Made in the USA

Ok, just spent a week at Oshgosh like quite a few of you and, although
I noticed this before it just hasn't changed much. How many LSA's are
made in the U.S.A.? I don't mean assembled, I mean, manufactured. Is it
really impossible for Americans to design, manufacture, and sell
products at a reasonable price and still make a living? Aircraft should
be one thing my country could excel at. We have everything needed,
materials, knowledge, ability, and desire, but most every aircraft in
this category is either imported or the parts are imported and then
assembled here.
I'm not talking about a product that cost more to make than to just
buy a cheap import. Light Sport planes have gone through the roof in
just a matter of a couple of years. You can't convince me that there
isn't a plane that can be designed and manufactured for a competitve
price. It's not that I am against any other country making a buck here.
I'm just very dissapointed in Americans not even trying. What happened
here?
Just a thought.
Lou

In a previous article, "Lou" said:
I noticed this before it just hasn't changed much. How many LSA's are
made in the U.S.A.? I don't mean assembled, I mean, manufactured. Is it
really impossible for Americans to design, manufacture, and sell

You have to remember that LSA is a response to an existing European class
(Microlight?). Most LSAs you see now were developed in Europe a few years
ago for that class - but as LSA matures, more US manufacturers will step
up. Just look at Cessna - they had a proof of concept demonstrator there,
and with their name recognition I bet they'd sell hundreds of them if they
went into production. All those flight schools looking to replace their
aging 150s would be a sure bet to prefer a new Cessna.

It will help when US manufacturers come up with an engine that can compete
with the Rotax and Jabiru ones.


--
Paul Tomblin http://xcski.com/blogs/pt/
`I was all fired up to write a big rant, but instead found apathy to be a
more worthwhile solution.' --- Ashley Penney

You may be right about the LSA being a response to the mircrolights of
Eroupe, but it was my understanding that LSA was to lower the cost and
requirements of flying. This way USA would increase their pilot
community instead of the current decrease. Now I will agree with you
that Americans need to develop a good engine to compete rather than the
dissappointing choices we have now. Really, how hard can this be for
any of the current engine (not limited to aviation) manufacturer's to
figure out. Honda was smart enough to see that an airplane engine alone
was bringing in more money than some of thier cars.
As for Cessna's proof of concept. I would be very suprised if it sold
for under $120,000.
If this is the case I don't think you will see alot of 152's being
replaced with this airplane. They won't be targeting that group so
their advertising points will not be towards this group. After all if
you can get a plane with the same qualities as a Cessna for $20.000 and
the flight school needs five planes for replacement, It would be like a
buy 5 get one free sale.
Lou

In a previous article, "Lou" said:
You may be right about the LSA being a response to the mircrolights of
Eroupe, but it was my understanding that LSA was to lower the cost and

Look at the max gross weight on LSA. 1320 pounds isn't a very round
number and you might wonder why they chose it, but the Microlight class
was already limited to 600kg and they just converted that to pounds and
rounded down a bit.

figure out. Honda was smart enough to see that an airplane engine alone
was bringing in more money than some of thier cars.

Except they're only looking at jets. People looking for cheap aircraft
aren't looking at jets. Several other car makers have tried aircraft
engine development, and decided it wasn't a money maker. And Continental
and Lycoming will just want to produce smaller versions of their existing
old-technology engines.

As for Cessna's proof of concept. I would be very suprised if it sold
for under $120,000.

I would be very surprised if it wasn't between $90K and $100K, since that
seems to be the competitive price for LSA.

And after they've been on the market a few years, I'll be looking to buy a
used one.

--
Paul Tomblin http://xcski.com/blogs/pt/
Education is what remains after one has forgotten everything he learned
in school. -- A. Einstein

Paul Tomblin wrote:

As for Cessna's proof of concept. I would be very suprised if it sold
for under $120,000.

I would be very surprised if it wasn't between $90K and $100K, since
that seems to be the competitive price for LSA.

If you see Poland or Tchek LSA (JAR-VLA) plane, you can't expect long
life, made like ultralight.
If you see a C150, you see planes with thousand flying hours....

I would prefer spend $120k for Cessna LSA (or french APM01) than $90k
for an AT3

http://www.apm20lionceau.com/
http://www.edsmart.com/falcon/at3.htm


by
--
Pub: http://www.slowfood.fr/france
Philippe Vessaire Ò¿Ó¬

On Tue, 1 Aug 2006 14:43:13 +0000 (UTC), (Paul
Tomblin) wrote:

You may be right about the LSA being a response to the mircrolights of
Eroupe....

Not precisely. The Sport Pilot limits were established to coincide with the
European Microlight definition. This meant that most, if not all, of the
existing, in-production Microlights already met Sport Pilot. To sell their
aircraft as ready-to-fly in the US, the European manufacturers then merely had
to take their aircraft through the new LSA certification process.

Until the LSA regulations were finalized, a US manufacturer didn't dare produce
an aircraft unless they intended to compete in the already-crowded European
market.

As for Cessna's proof of concept. I would be very suprised if it sold
for under $120,000.

I would be very surprised if it wasn't between $90K and $100K, since that
seems to be the competitive price for LSA.

I've heard that the new Cessna isn't intended as an LSA. It meets the Sport
Pilot limits, but Cessna will supposedly certify it in the Normal category.

It makes a heck of a lot of sense. Cessna has all the corporate processes for a
Normal category certification, and they minimize their liability exposure since
maintenance and inspections will still require A&Ps.

And after they've been on the market a few years, I'll be looking to buy a
used one.

Even better, in a few years, used engines will be available for the homebuilt
market.

Ron Wanttaja

Even better, in a few years, used engines will be available for the
homebuilt
market.

Nah, they are mostly Rotax. I suspect the Rotax engines will be pretty much
shot when they come out of the "other" airplanes.
--
Jim in NC

"Ron Wanttaja" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 1 Aug 2006 14:43:13 +0000 (UTC), (Paul
Tomblin) wrote:

You may be right about the LSA being a response to the mircrolights of
Eroupe....

Not precisely. The Sport Pilot limits were established to coincide with
the
European Microlight definition. This meant that most, if not all, of the
existing, in-production Microlights already met Sport Pilot. To sell
their
aircraft as ready-to-fly in the US, the European manufacturers then merely
had
to take their aircraft through the new LSA certification process.

Until the LSA regulations were finalized, a US manufacturer didn't dare
produce
an aircraft unless they intended to compete in the already-crowded
European
market.

As for Cessna's proof of concept. I would be very suprised if it sold
for under $120,000.

I would be very surprised if it wasn't between $90K and $100K, since that
seems to be the competitive price for LSA.

I've heard that the new Cessna isn't intended as an LSA. It meets the
Sport
Pilot limits, but Cessna will supposedly certify it in the Normal
category.

It makes a heck of a lot of sense. Cessna has all the corporate processes
for a
Normal category certification, and they minimize their liability exposure
since
maintenance and inspections will still require A&Ps.


snip

Personally, I think Cessna has nailed it. The LSA will be the new 152,
flight schools can use it for both PPL and SP instruction, insurance will be
lower, and they build the brand. And their new "next generation" aircraft
appears to be the right plane at the right time as well.

Paul Tomblin wrote:
In a previous article, "Lou" said:

....
Honda was smart enough to see that an airplane engine alone
was bringing in more money than some of thier cars.

Except they're only looking at jets. People looking for cheap aircraft
aren't looking at jets. Several other car makers have tried aircraft
engine development, and decided it wasn't a money maker. And Continental
and Lycoming will just want to produce smaller versions of their existing
old-technology engines.

Where are the Zenoah (Xenoah) engines made?

--

FF

wrote in message
oups.com...

...
Where are the Zenoah (Xenoah) engines made?


In the Zenoah factory. Duh...

:-)

http://www.zenoah.net/index.html

Appears to be in Japan.

--
Geoff
The Sea Hawk at Wow Way d0t Com
remove spaces and make the obvious substitutions to reply by mail
When immigration is outlawed, only outlaws will immigrate.