How dangerous is soaring?

When I started soaring on mid 80's, everybody said that soaring is the
safest aviation sport, almost safer than most 'real' sports. You can't
brake your leg while flying Only when you hit the ground

Though on a first year 4 pilots that I knew got killed with glider.
Not a good start. And during the years I have counted over 20
fatalities where I can say they either they were my friends or I knew
them well. Plus all the other fatalities. Almost every week on this
group, we get another sad message informing yet another fatality. And
most of the cases, pilots has been extremely experiensed. We know that
they haven't done any stupid moves, they just lost the control of the
plane on wrong situation or the plane has failed on them. I personally
feel that I am on the edge to quit this sport because of that. I don't
want to see not even one more friend passing away. I want to push that
off my mind.

Soaring is the greatest sport I can imagine. No other sport can give
me the feeling, same view, same fellowship etc etc. But is it worth
it???

PS

But is it worth
it???

(resounding) YES

On Oct 30, 5:56 am, wrote:
When I started soaring on mid 80's, everybody said that soaring is the
safest aviation sport, almost safer than most 'real' sports. You can't
brake your leg while flying Only when you hit the ground

Though on a first year 4 pilots that I knew got killed with glider.
Not a good start. And during the years I have counted over 20
fatalities where I can say they either they were my friends or I knew
them well. Plus all the other fatalities. Almost every week on this
group, we get another sad message informing yet another fatality. And
most of the cases, pilots has been extremely experiensed. We know that
they haven't done any stupid moves, they just lost the control of the
plane on wrong situation or the plane has failed on them. I personally
feel that I am on the edge to quit this sport because of that. I don't
want to see not even one more friend passing away. I want to push that
off my mind.

Soaring is the greatest sport I can imagine. No other sport can give
me the feeling, same view, same fellowship etc etc. But is it worth
it???

PS

YES!
UH

The question was "Is it worth it ?". I used to ski and sail, and then
I discovered soaring. That was 20 + years ago. I have been soaring
since, haven't sailed for some 15 years, and also sold all my
(obsolete) ski gear . The answer, then, is an unequivocal " YES " !

Cheers, Charles

Patrick,



Quitting the sport will not stop further fatalities (Except possibly
your own from flying. I can assure you that life itself is fatal.). We
are going to continue this sport whether you continue in it or not.
What will change is that you no longer have the contact with one of the
most diverse and interesting groups around. We will still be flying,
soaring, laughing, lying about our accomplishments over a beer, having
the adventures of a retrieve, seeing firsthand the grandeur of nature
and weather, experiencing the satisfaction of launching into the skies
and returning home, making new friends .... and, yes, possibly losing a
few of them along the way.



How dangerous is soaring? My primary instructor would answer the
question, "Soaring is bloody dangerous! Anytime you get more than about
3 feet off the ground (whether on a ladder, airplane, rooftop) or travel
more than about 15 miles per hour (whether in a car, bicycle, skis, or
airplane), you are taking your life in your own hands."



Let's be diligent about our safety with procedures, better equipment,
etc. But at the end of the day, it is still going to be more dangerous
than not flying.



I want to live to see what my great-grandchildren become. But when they
ask what I did with my life, I don't want to say "Well, I worked 40
years and then I retired." I want to tell them about the time that I
thermalled with a bald eagle, or the time I saw a corn stalk flying in
the thermal over Uvalde, or the grandeur of the mountains and lakes in
the western US, or the magic of seeing my "glory" on a cloud below me.



Is it worth it? Each person has to answer it for themselves.



For me, absolutely.





Larry Goddard

01 "zero one" USA






"
wrote in message
ups.com:

When I started soaring on mid 80's, everybody said that soaring is the
safest aviation sport, almost safer than most 'real' sports. You can't
brake your leg while flying Only when you hit the ground

Though on a first year 4 pilots that I knew got killed with glider.
Not a good start. And during the years I have counted over 20
fatalities where I can say they either they were my friends or I knew
them well. Plus all the other fatalities. Almost every week on this
group, we get another sad message informing yet another fatality. And
most of the cases, pilots has been extremely experiensed. We know that
they haven't done any stupid moves, they just lost the control of the
plane on wrong situation or the plane has failed on them. I personally
feel that I am on the edge to quit this sport because of that. I don't
want to see not even one more friend passing away. I want to push that
off my mind.

Soaring is the greatest sport I can imagine. No other sport can give
me the feeling, same view, same fellowship etc etc. But is it worth
it???

PS

wrote in message
ups.com...
When I started soaring on mid 80's, everybody said that soaring is the
safest aviation sport, almost safer than most 'real' sports. You can't
brake your leg while flying Only when you hit the ground

Though on a first year 4 pilots that I knew got killed with glider.
Not a good start. And during the years I have counted over 20
fatalities where I can say they either they were my friends or I knew
them well. Plus all the other fatalities. Almost every week on this
group, we get another sad message informing yet another fatality. And
most of the cases, pilots has been extremely experiensed. We know that
they haven't done any stupid moves, they just lost the control of the
plane on wrong situation or the plane has failed on them. I personally
feel that I am on the edge to quit this sport because of that. I don't
want to see not even one more friend passing away. I want to push that
off my mind.

Soaring is the greatest sport I can imagine. No other sport can give
me the feeling, same view, same fellowship etc etc. But is it worth
it???

PS

Definitely.

Let me put a little perspective on it for you - in Denmark we've not had any
fatalities in the last (off the top of my head) 10 years, and on average we
have about 3-5 incidents/accidents every year. This compared to about
(roughly estimated) 50.000 operations a year so at least here Soaring is the
safest aviation sport you can find.

/J

Almost every week on this
group, we get another sad message informing yet another fatality. And
most of the cases, pilots has been extremely experiensed. We know that
they haven't done any stupid moves, they just lost the control of the
plane on wrong situation or the plane has failed on them.

This is unfortunately not a very accurate picture. The newsgroup tends
to hear of the "extremely experienced" category, but the majority of
the 4-6 fatalities per year in the US are fairly simple screwups
around the home airport.

The vast majority of the fatalities among the "extremely experienced"
pilots also come down to fairly simple pilot errors -- trying to ridge
soar some tiny bump in a strong wind, thermal up off the middle of the
canyon, make that last desperate transition, flying over unlandable
terrain because "there is sure to be a thermal there" and so forth.
More experienced pilots take greater risks. Fatalities from "losing
control" or "the plane has failed on them" are essentially unheard
of.

So here's the bottom line. Flying gliders is not inherently risky. We
only fly in good weather, our systems are very simple, and there is no
engine to fail. This rules out 90% of the causes of accidents in light
planes. If our pilot training and rules of engagement were the same as
that of the airlines, our fatality rate would be less then theirs.

That's why numbers are misleading. It's not Russian roulette, with the
question "how many chambers are loaded?'" A danger rate anywhere
between extreme motocross and airline flying is entirely in your own
hands.

The accident-waiting-to-happen takes this fact and says "they were all
pilot errors. A truly skilled pilot like me would never do something
so stupid." This is a good defense mechanism, but a wiser pilot (or
spouse!) will notice that the pilots who crashed felt the same way.

The wiser pilot remembers the temptations to which his much more
skilled and accomplished friends fell, and understands "where they
failed I could fail as well." He studies obsessively, makes
contingency plans and sets personal limits, and runs through his
checklist once more.

Why do we do it? In the end, there is nothing in the world like the
sense of wonder and accomplishment at the end of a long cross-country
soaring day.

John Cochrane

On 30 Oct, 09:56, wrote:

Almost every week on this
group, we get another sad message informing yet another fatality. And
most of the cases, pilots has been extremely experiensed. We know that
they haven't done any stupid moves, they just lost the control of the
plane on wrong situation or the plane has failed on them.

People often ask me "Is gliding safe?" My reply is always the same -
"No, it is not safe, but it's is not hard to make it personally safer
- don't be bloody stupid."

Does S&G still publish accident reports [1]? They used to categorize
the causes: "Instructor failed to take over in time", "Poor field
selection", "Rigging error" and so on. However, almost all - certainly
90+% - of accidents had the same meta-cause lurking behind the report:
bloody stupidity.

Pressing on through an unlandable area on a dying day? Bloody stupid.

Forgetting to connect the elevator before launching, and then not
checking? Bloody stupid.

Flying in dangerously tight gaggles for the sake of a few points?
Bloody stupid.

"Just [losing] the control of the plane on wrong situation"? Bloody
stupid, almost certainly.

All you have to do is not be bloody stupid (and discourage bloody
stupidity amongst those around you) and you can decrease your own risk
enormously.

Ian

On 30 Oct, 09:56, wrote:

Almost every week on this
group, we get another sad message informing yet another fatality. And
most of the cases, pilots has been extremely experiensed. We know that
they haven't done any stupid moves, they just lost the control of the
plane on wrong situation or the plane has failed on them.

People often ask me "Is gliding safe?" My reply is always the same -
"No, it is not safe, but it's is not hard to make it personally safer
- don't be bloody stupid."

Does S&G still publish accident reports [1]? They used to categorize
the causes: "Instructor failed to take over in time", "Poor field
selection", "Rigging error" and so on. However, almost all - certainly
90+% - of accidents had the same meta-cause lurking behind the report:
bloody stupidity.

Pressing on through an unlandable area on a dying day? Bloody stupid.

Forgetting to connect the elevator before launching, and then not
checking? Bloody stupid.

Flying in dangerously tight gaggles for the sake of a few points?
Bloody stupid.

"Just [losing] the control of the plane on wrong situation"? Bloody
stupid, almost certainly.

All you have to do is not be bloody stupid (and discourage bloody
stupidity amongst those around you) and you can decrease your own risk
enormously.

Ian

[1] Don't read it any more. There are only so many time I can be
enthralled by "Derek Piggott takes a fresh look at winch launching",
"Our chairman's son goes solo on his sixteenth birthday" and the task
for Day 3 of the last Eastern Counties Club Class competition.

On 30 Oct, 13:24, "01-- Zero One" wrote:

Let's be diligent about our safety with procedures, better equipment,
etc. But at the end of the day, it is still going to be more dangerous
than not flying. ...
Is it worth it? Each person has to answer it for themselves.

For me, absolutely.

Absolutely. We must always beware of people and clubs who claim that
"Safety is the prime concern." If they really meant it, they wouldn't
go gliding at all. It's a hobby - for most of us - so fun is our prime
concern, followed by as much safety as we can reasonably fit in.

Ian