HELP! To buy or not...rough 63 aztec for $25,000

I have a chance to buy a 63 aztec in rough condition. It would be my
first plane. Engines have 1200 smoh but one has a cracked cylinder.
(estimated repair, $5000?) Paint is poor. ($5000 estimate?) Interior is
poor ($5000 estimate?). Brand new props. Only 1 nav/com. older avionics.
Auto pilot broken. It was used as a survey aircraft and has a certified
hole cut. I could potentially use it for aerial work as my company subs
about $50,000 in photography per year (5 jobs). I have a good pilot to
split costs with. He has the commercial rating and would fly while
working. Insurance would be $10,000 for the commercial type. I am a bit
concerned about the
$80/ hour fuel burn and the potential for gremlins on an older not so
well maintained airplane. The price seems very reasonable which is the
main motivation for buying. 25,000+5000+5000+5000= $40,000 for a aztec
with new props, survey hole, new paint and interior. Am I missing
something? Is this a good deal? Most of the similar year planes I have
seen are about $80,000. My buddy is an avionics repaiman and would
thoroughly check the plane prior to the purchase. Could it be resold at
a profit if I needed to? Please give any advice as I don't want to make
a big mistake. Thanks in advance.
David

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"david" wrote in message
...
I have a chance to buy a 63 aztec in rough condition. It would be my
first plane. Engines have 1200 smoh but one has a cracked cylinder.
(estimated repair, $5000?) Paint is poor. ($5000 estimate?) Interior is
poor ($5000 estimate?). Brand new props. Only 1 nav/com. older avionics.
Auto pilot broken. It was used as a survey aircraft and has a certified
hole cut. I could potentially use it for aerial work as my company subs
about $50,000 in photography per year (5 jobs). I have a good pilot to
split costs with. He has the commercial rating and would fly while
working. Insurance would be $10,000 for the commercial type. I am a bit
concerned about the
$80/ hour fuel burn and the potential for gremlins on an older not so
well maintained airplane. The price seems very reasonable which is the
main motivation for buying. 25,000+5000+5000+5000= $40,000 for a aztec
with new props, survey hole, new paint and interior. Am I missing
something? Is this a good deal? Most of the similar year planes I have
seen are about $80,000. My buddy is an avionics repaiman and would
thoroughly check the plane prior to the purchase. Could it be resold at
a profit if I needed to? Please give any advice as I don't want to make
a big mistake. Thanks in advance.
David

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Buy it for $25K put $100K into it and you will have a $75K airplane.

Buy it for $25K put $100K into it and you will have a $75K airplane.

Wow! Those numbers tell almost the exact story of my 1966 Turbo Aztec.

The subject line of this story caught my eye because that's the amount
of the first check we wrote for our plane (as "salvage - for parts
only"). We've often said it would have still been a bad deal if we'd
gotten it for nothing, but it's a great plane and I have a hard time
imagining anything else working so well for our typical trips.

If I saw a deal like this, I'd be inclined to work something out with
the owner to get the plane through a decent annual inspection and into
airworthiness before writing a check for it. I'd be happy to pay for
the repairs (up to some limit) to be able to purchase a *flying* plane
instead of just one with potential. If you have a mechanic friend and
the plane is already in your backyard, it's a little different, but I
wouldn't want to go through driving two hours each way to work on
restoration again.

Good luck.

--kyler

"Dave Stadt" writes:

Buy it for $25K put $100K into it and you will have a $75K airplane.

Wow! Those numbers tell almost the exact story of my 1966 Turbo Aztec.
Mine was sold as "salvage - parts only" though.

The subject line of this story caught my eye because that's the amount
of the first check we wrote for our plane (as "salvage - for parts
only"). We've often said it would have still been a bad deal if we'd
gotten it for nothing, but it's a great plane and I have a hard time
imagining anything else working so well for our typical trips.

If I went through this again, I'd want to work out something with the
seller so that I could buy an airworthy plane. That might mean making
some agreement on paying up to some maximum amount to have a mechanic
work on the plane before it becomes yours. You'd still pay for the
work but if it turns out that the spar needs to be replaced (about the
only thing mine *didn't* need), you'd be off the hook.

--kyler

Well, David, only you can answer this question: Are you ready for a
multi-year headache in exchange for perhaps saving yourself fairly
significant money?

If the answer is "yes", go for it.

But be prepared for a long slog in the mud.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

"david" wrote in message
...
I have a chance to buy a 63 aztec in rough condition. It would be my
first plane. Engines have 1200 smoh but one has a cracked cylinder.
(estimated repair, $5000?) Paint is poor. ($5000 estimate?) Interior is
poor ($5000 estimate?). Brand new props. Only 1 nav/com. older avionics.
Auto pilot broken. It was used as a survey aircraft and has a certified
hole cut. I could potentially use it for aerial work as my company subs
about $50,000 in photography per year (5 jobs). I have a good pilot to
split costs with. He has the commercial rating and would fly while
working. Insurance would be $10,000 for the commercial type. I am a bit
concerned about the
$80/ hour fuel burn and the potential for gremlins on an older not so
well maintained airplane. The price seems very reasonable which is the
main motivation for buying. 25,000+5000+5000+5000= $40,000 for a aztec
with new props, survey hole, new paint and interior. Am I missing
something? Is this a good deal? Most of the similar year planes I have
seen are about $80,000. My buddy is an avionics repaiman and would
thoroughly check the plane prior to the purchase. Could it be resold at
a profit if I needed to? Please give any advice as I don't want to make
a big mistake. Thanks in advance.
David

("david" wrote)
snip
25,000+5000+5000+5000= $40,000 for a aztec
with new props, survey hole, new paint and interior. Am I missing
something? Is this a good deal? Most of the similar year planes I have
seen are about $80,000. My buddy is an avionics repaiman and would
thoroughly check the plane prior to the purchase. Could it be resold at
a profit if I needed to? Please give any advice as I don't want to make
a big mistake. Thanks in advance.


Saw this question a few years ago:
If the plane was given to you (free) tomorrow, what would you do with it?

Oh boy, I got a "free" plane with....[insert laundry list of liabilities here]
Still a good deal?

BTW, I've only seen Aztecs from the ground - I like em.

Oh, here's the other rec.aviation question that often comes up - What's your
projected average mission? Will something else (maybe) fill the bill? Or is the
saying fit the bill?

Good luck, keep us posted.

--
Montblack
http://lumma.de/mt/archives/bart.gif

The risks in such a transaction are HUGE! If you LIKE fiddling with
planes, have lots of time available and a very supportive shop to work
with, there is a chance you won't lose TOO much... the chance that you
will have a satisfactory plane without things continually going wrong
are slim, and the chance you can sell it at a profit is ZERO.

People who do take on such a project do it as a pastime, and hope their
pastime doesn't cost them TOO much.

Rich

david wrote:
I have a chance to buy a 63 aztec in rough condition.


Could it be resold at
a profit if I needed to? Please give any advice as I don't want to make
a big mistake. Thanks in advance.
David

Paint is poor. ($5000 estimate?)

Since it cost me $12,000 to paint my Skyhawk, this seems a little low for an
Aztec.


www.Rosspilot.com

"Rosspilot" wrote in message ...
Paint is poor. ($5000 estimate?)

Since it cost me $12,000 to paint my Skyhawk, this seems a little low for an
Aztec.

Ouch, it's only costing me about 6K to have the Navion painted. Of course,
I'm doing it in a rather low cost area of the country.

Paint is poor. ($5000 estimate?)

Since it cost me $12,000 to paint my Skyhawk, this seems a little low for
an
Aztec.

Ouch, it's only costing me about 6K to have the Navion painted. Of course,
I'm doing it in a rather low cost area of the country.

I actually flew mine from New York to Florida to have the paint job done there
(Hoover Aircraft Refinishing-Tampa Bay Exec). The job included new glass all
around, and was done in Jan 2000. Here I am 4 years later and she still looks
brand new--tied down outside in the brutal heat of August and the freezing snow
and ice of New York winter. When I was asking for quotes up here in the NY
area, I was getting $12-14K prices and 6 month waiting lists.


www.Rosspilot.com