"Rescue" flight, PPL

Let's restate the problem so we can see some absurdities and discover why
lawyers have more money than the rest of us...

It is illegal in our hypothetical state to carry passengers in a motor
vehicle for compensation unless one has a chauffeur's license or a
commercial driver's license.

My girlfriend calls me and tells me her car has broken down. She asks me to
come pick her up.

I am otherwise occupied, so I ask my neighbor for assistance.

My neighbor does not own a car. Normally, he rents or borrows one when he
needs a car.

My neighbor doesn't have a chauffeur's license or a commercial driver's
license; he only has an ordinary driver's license.

I ask my neighbor if he will take my car and go pick up my girlfriend.

Is my neighbor's usage of my car "compensation", placing him in violation of
the licensing laws?



"Joe Johnson" wrote in message
m...
Last week, as I returned to my rental FBO after an evening local flight,
the
clerk on duty said an instructor and his student were stuck at an airport
about 40 minutes away. I spoke to the instructor on the phone and I
agreed
to fly up and bring them back. He mentioned that, of course, I wouldn't
have to pay for the aircraft time. Did I violate the terms of my PPL by
accepting free time in the airplane as "compensation" for picking them up
and bringing them back? Should I therefore have paid a proportional share
of the costs?

Is your neighbor logging the driving time in his logbook for the
furtherance of a commercial drivers license??

ducking
Dave

Bill Denton wrote:
Let's restate the problem so we can see some absurdities and discover why
lawyers have more money than the rest of us...

It is illegal in our hypothetical state to carry passengers in a motor
vehicle for compensation unless one has a chauffeur's license or a
commercial driver's license.

My girlfriend calls me and tells me her car has broken down. She asks me to
come pick her up.

I am otherwise occupied, so I ask my neighbor for assistance.

My neighbor does not own a car. Normally, he rents or borrows one when he
needs a car.

My neighbor doesn't have a chauffeur's license or a commercial driver's
license; he only has an ordinary driver's license.

I ask my neighbor if he will take my car and go pick up my girlfriend.

Is my neighbor's usage of my car "compensation", placing him in violation of
the licensing laws?



"Joe Johnson" wrote in message
m...

Last week, as I returned to my rental FBO after an evening local flight,

the

clerk on duty said an instructor and his student were stuck at an airport
about 40 minutes away. I spoke to the instructor on the phone and I

agreed

to fly up and bring them back. He mentioned that, of course, I wouldn't
have to pay for the aircraft time. Did I violate the terms of my PPL by
accepting free time in the airplane as "compensation" for picking them up
and bringing them back? Should I therefore have paid a proportional share
of the costs?

Dave S wrote:

Is your neighbor logging the driving time in his logbook for the
furtherance of a commercial drivers license??

At the point where the needed hours are logged and any further hours
don't help in that regard does it suddenly get legal?

"Newps" wrote in message
...


Dave S wrote:

Is your neighbor logging the driving time in his logbook for the
furtherance of a commercial drivers license??

At the point where the needed hours are logged and any further hours don't
help in that regard does it suddenly get legal?


I've pondered the same question. What is legal is a grey area and I think
the question is whether the FAA would try to prosecute under those
circumstances when you have the strong argument that the "free" time has no
commercial value to you. Perhaps if you *really* annoyed someone there they
would go after you but normally I would suspect something like this is well
under their radar.

Peter Gottlieb wrote:


"Newps" wrote in message
...


Dave S wrote:

Is your neighbor logging the driving time in his logbook for the
furtherance of a commercial drivers license??

At the point where the needed hours are logged and any further hours
don't help in that regard does it suddenly get legal?


I've pondered the same question.

Using this reasoning, simply not logging the hours - or otherwise not
counting them towards anything - would convert this from illegal to legal.
Weird...but this is the FAA under discussion, recall laugh.

I'd really love to read this letter. If the issue is the counting of time
towards a rating, then not counting the time might be a loophole. If the
issue, though, is getting flight time - ie. time when we're enjoying
ourselves - for free, then no loophole.

Well...we could put in our log the comment "didn't have fun", or some such
laugh. But who'd believe that?

- Andrew

On Fri, 20 Aug 2004 09:39:35 -0600, Newps wrote:



Dave S wrote:

Is your neighbor logging the driving time in his logbook for the
furtherance of a commercial drivers license??

At the point where the needed hours are logged and any further hours
don't help in that regard does it suddenly get legal?

I'm shooting from the hip here, with no time to research this but I
was always under the impression that the flight time would not
represent any "value" to the pilot if it were not eligible to be used
toward a rating. It would be interesting to hear a full legal
interpretation of this issue. It seems kind of odd that an activity
could be legal if not logged and illegal if logged. The government
does work in strange ways at times.

Rich Russell

Richard Russell wrote:

I'm shooting from the hip here, with no time to research this but I
was always under the impression that the flight time would not
represent any "value" to the pilot if it were not eligible to be used
toward a rating.

You are probably correct IMO, since the only prosecution cases I've heard of are ones
in which it was argued that the pilot intended to use the time as justification for
an additional rating.

George Patterson
If you want to know God's opinion of money, just look at the people
he gives it to.

Bill Denton wrote:

Is my neighbor's usage of my car "compensation", placing him in violation of
the licensing laws?

If your hypothetical State requires a certain number of hours driving cars like yours
to qualify for a chaffeur's license, yes.

George Patterson
If you want to know God's opinion of money, just look at the people
he gives it to.