Cessna forced down by the Feds

On Thu, 27 Jan 2005 10:56:36 -0800, "Peter Duniho"
wrote:

wrote in message
roups.com...
I've read this was a 172P model (but not confirmed it). I'm still
trying to figure out how they got four adults into the plane with a
valid W&B.

You gotta be kidding:-)) Some one smuggling illegal aliens is going
to worry about a legal W&B?


It just depends on the adults. I have flown a C172 with all seats filled by
adults. As long as the adults aren't too heavy, it's just fine.

Why anyone would immediately assume that "adult" means "170 pounds" is
beyond me.

Basically because you almost have to hunt to find 4 adults who are
170# or under. The percent gets smaller every day. The FAA was
talking about raising the average to 200#.

I frequently see messages like yours, implying that it's
impossible to fly four adults in a C172, written by people without even

Not impossible, just difficult to find many times.

Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member)
(N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair)
www.rogerhalstead.com

enough imagination to consider a very realistic legal-four-adult scenario.

Pete

wrote in message oups.com...
I've read this was a 172P model (but not confirmed it). I'm still
trying to figure out how they got four adults into the plane with a
valid W&B.


Are you guys sure it was forced down by the feds? It could have been helped down by a gravity hole...

"Roger" wrote in message
...

Basically because you almost have to hunt to find 4 adults who are
170# or under.

Well, they *are* Chinese, so they may be small, depending on where in China
they come from.

"Roger" wrote in message
...
Why anyone would immediately assume that "adult" means "170 pounds" is
beyond me.

Basically because you almost have to hunt to find 4 adults who are
170# or under. The percent gets smaller every day. The FAA was
talking about raising the average to 200#.

Yes, Americans are getting fatter. But some of us have friends who actually
manage to avoid making their diet consist primarily of McDonald's and frozen
dinners.

Especially for those of us that actually hang out with females, it's not
hard at all to find adults who weigh less than 170 pounds.

In any case, the point is that assuming that a C172 is overweight just
because four adults are aboard is dumb. That said, what's really dumb is
that we're talking about whether the airplane was overweight, rather than
the obscenity of a government that is willing to use deadly force when they
have not established the guilt of everyone (or anyone) being fired upon.

Pete

I've read this was a 172P model (but not confirmed it). I'm still
trying to figure out how they got four adults into the plane with a
valid W&B.


Are you guys sure it was forced down by the feds? It could have been
helped down by a gravity hole...


empty wt = 1470 mom = 57330
25 gal fuel = 150 mom = 6900
frt pass & pilot = 325 mom = 13650
rear pass = 290 mom = 21170
"luggage" = 120 mom = 11400
---------------------------------
totals = 2355 lbs 110450 lb/ins (C.G. @ 46.9)


Assuming that the passengers were a little on the small side, it could be
done.

Roger wrote:

Basically because you almost have to hunt to find 4 adults who are
170# or under.

Four *American* adults, yes. You have to hunt pretty hard to find four Chinese
adults who weigh that much. And C.J.'s post says that's the nationality of the
passengers.

George Patterson
He who marries for money earns every penny of it.

"Mike W." wrote:

Anybody care to work up a theoretical w&b on this?

Ok. With 30 gallons of fuel, 310 pounds in the front seats, 240 pounds in the
back, and 120 in the luggage compartment, a 1980 Cessna 172 with a decent radio
stack is under max gross and within the envelope. Since most of the Chinese men
I've known weigh around 140 pounds and most of the women tilt the scales below
120, it's certainly doable.

Did the AP article say if they were all adults?

George Patterson
He who marries for money earns every penny of it.

On Tue, 25 Jan 2005 08:33:41 -0800, "C J Campbell"
wrote in
::

Apparently an immigrant smuggling operation. AP is reporting a Cessna was
forced down Tuesday morning near San Antonio with four Chinese nationals on
board. The plane, N98873, is supposedly owned by Afzal Hameed and Alyce S.
Taylor.

Are you able to provide a link to the AP article?

"Larry Dighera" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 25 Jan 2005 08:33:41 -0800, "C J Campbell"
wrote in
::

Apparently an immigrant smuggling operation. AP is reporting a Cessna was
forced down Tuesday morning near San Antonio with four Chinese nationals
on
board. The plane, N98873, is supposedly owned by Afzal Hameed and Alyce
S.
Taylor.

Are you able to provide a link to the AP article?

Every time I provide a link it starts a whole sub-thread about spyware. I
will look and see if I can find it again, though.

Okay, I did not find it, but I found this somewhat more sensationalized
version he

http://makeashorterlink.com/?P2412325A

The original AP article said that there was no link to terrorism, so this
article must have used different sources. Note that they had to backtrack a
little in a follow-up article. Of course, if you are really paranoid, maybe
the Department of Homeland Fear suppressed the terrorism link "in order to
avoid widespread panic." Who knows?

Ah, here is a more subdued AP link:

http://www.suntimes.com/output/news/plane25.html

On Fri, 28 Jan 2005 07:25:39 -0800, "C J Campbell"
wrote in
::

Every time I provide a link it starts a whole sub-thread about spyware.

Consider the fact that copyright laws Fair Use policy permits the
inclusion of excerpts (as opposed to the complete article) of
copyrighted material. So it is appropriate to include some of the
salient portions of articles in such a post.


Okay, I did not find it, but I found this somewhat more sensationalized
version he

http://makeashorterlink.com/?P2412325A

The original AP article said that there was no link to terrorism, so this
article must have used different sources. Note that they had to backtrack a
little in a follow-up article. Of course, if you are really paranoid, maybe
the Department of Homeland Fear suppressed the terrorism link "in order to
avoid widespread panic." Who knows?

Ah, here is a more subdued AP link:

http://www.suntimes.com/output/news/plane25.html


Thank you for the links.

About 4,000 illegal immigrants of various nationalities enter the US
through the southern border daily. The INS interdicts only about 20%
of them. Ranchers on the border are beginning to take matters into
their own hands. The Department of Homeland Security is another
pathetic joke on the citizenry of this noble nation perpetrated by the
baby Bush administration, IMNSHO.