Fast helicopters

In the last weeks, there is a big silence in this NG regarding fast flying
helicopters. Please have a look at www.vranek.ch/diskrotor.htm and publish
your comments and questions if any in this NG.
Geoge

George Vranek wrote:

In the last weeks, there is a big silence in this NG regarding fast flying
helicopters.

And your point is....?????

Please have a look at www.vranek.ch/diskrotor.htm and publish
your comments and questions if any in this NG.

Okay.... It's your personal vanity website with slow loading graphics
and tiny blue type on a gray and black background that's extremely
difficult to read.

That was my comment..... Now my question.

Why is it important that we go and visit your personal vanity
website...???

Geoge

Bernie

More moving parts costing even more money with more of a chance of falling
to the ground and making more of a mess. The only thing that is not
excessive about that..... thing....... is the amount of insurance companies
willing to insure it.

"George Vranek" wrote in message
...
In the last weeks, there is a big silence in this NG regarding fast flying
helicopters. Please have a look at www.vranek.ch/diskrotor.htm and publish
your comments and questions if any in this NG.
Geoge

not surprised opened it what was i supposed to sea any one any idea

"George Vranek" wrote:

helicopters. Please have a look at www.vranek.ch/diskrotor.htm and publish

The diskrotor/diskCopter has been discussed here before. The
conclusion was that it was impractical and probably impossible. When
flying forward, the normal helicopter disk plane has a negative pitch
angle relative to the ground. Putting a huge round airfoil up there
with a negative pitch angle would make you crash and not fly faster.
Not only that, but the disk "airfoil" would not really be a very good
airfoil with the same shape on both ends would it. If you disagree, I
suggest you build a model and fly it faster than 100 mph and see what
happens.

Dennis.


Dennis Hawkins
n4mwd AT amsat DOT org (humans know what to do)

"A RECESSION is when you know somebody who is out of work.
A DEPRESSION is when YOU are out of work.
A RECOVERY is when all the H-1B's are out of work."
To find out what an H-1B is and how they are putting
Americans out of work, visit the following web site
and click on the "Exporting America" CNN news video:
http://zazona.com/ShameH1B/MediaClips.htm

The late and great aerodynamist ,Wieslaw Z. Stepmewski, believed that the
best answer for faster VTOL aircraft will be a unifying of the 'Intermeshing
Configuration', the 'ABC Principle' and 'Low Tip Speed Philosophy'.
For more info; http://www.UniCopter.com/1093.html

When flying forward, the Diskrotor Helicopter disk plane has a positive
pitch angle relative to the ground. The thrust necessary for forward flight
is provided by the jet stream and not by the rotor as a conventional
helicopter does. A model acc.to your proposal has flown stright and level 5
years ago. The disk airfoil has similar abilities as a conventional airfoil
with a partially open split flap, which are surprisingly good. See Ira H.
Abbot: Theory of Wing Sections or similar.

George

wrote in message
...
"George Vranek" wrote:

helicopters. Please have a look at www.vranek.ch/diskrotor.htm and
publish

The diskrotor/diskCopter has been discussed here before. The
conclusion was that it was impractical and probably impossible. When
flying forward, the normal helicopter disk plane has a negative pitch
angle relative to the ground. Putting a huge round airfoil up there
with a negative pitch angle would make you crash and not fly faster.
Not only that, but the disk "airfoil" would not really be a very good
airfoil with the same shape on both ends would it. If you disagree, I
suggest you build a model and fly it faster than 100 mph and see what
happens.

Dennis.


Dennis Hawkins
n4mwd AT amsat DOT org (humans know what to do)

"A RECESSION is when you know somebody who is out of work.
A DEPRESSION is when YOU are out of work.
A RECOVERY is when all the H-1B's are out of work."
To find out what an H-1B is and how they are putting
Americans out of work, visit the following web site
and click on the "Exporting America" CNN news video:
http://zazona.com/ShameH1B/MediaClips.htm

I still seriously doubt that such a craft would be practical or even
possible. Is there video of this model flying on the net somewhere?

In any case, simply adding wings to the side of a helicopter will
increase its maximum forward speed significantly without the nead for
a heavy disk and complex control systems.

Dennis.

"George Vranek" wrote:

When flying forward, the Diskrotor Helicopter disk plane has a positive
pitch angle relative to the ground. The thrust necessary for forward flight
is provided by the jet stream and not by the rotor as a conventional
helicopter does. A model acc.to your proposal has flown stright and level 5
years ago. The disk airfoil has similar abilities as a conventional airfoil
with a partially open split flap, which are surprisingly good. See Ira H.
Abbot: Theory of Wing Sections or similar.

George

wrote in message
...
"George Vranek" wrote:

helicopters. Please have a look at www.vranek.ch/diskrotor.htm and
publish

The diskrotor/diskCopter has been discussed here before. The
conclusion was that it was impractical and probably impossible. When
flying forward, the normal helicopter disk plane has a negative pitch
angle relative to the ground. Putting a huge round airfoil up there
with a negative pitch angle would make you crash and not fly faster.
Not only that, but the disk "airfoil" would not really be a very good
airfoil with the same shape on both ends would it. If you disagree, I
suggest you build a model and fly it faster than 100 mph and see what
happens.

Dennis.


Dennis Hawkins
n4mwd AT amsat DOT org (humans know what to do)

"A RECESSION is when you know somebody who is out of work.
A DEPRESSION is when YOU are out of work.
A RECOVERY is when all the H-1B's are out of work."
To find out what an H-1B is and how they are putting
Americans out of work, visit the following web site
and click on the "Exporting America" CNN news video:
http://zazona.com/ShameH1B/MediaClips.htm




Dennis Hawkins
n4mwd AT amsat DOT org (humans know what to do)

"A RECESSION is when you know somebody who is out of work.
A DEPRESSION is when YOU are out of work.
A RECOVERY is when all the H-1B's are out of work."
To find out what an H-1B is and how they are putting
Americans out of work, visit the following web site
and click on the "Exporting America" CNN news video:
http://zazona.com/ShameH1B/MediaClips.htm

I am sorry, but there is no video of this model. Nearly each helicopter
company has made trials with adding wings to their machines and all dropped
them again. During the hoverig the additional wing acts as a balast only and
reduces the hover efficiency of the machine. The heavy disk is able to store
a lot of kinetic energy, which allows vertical landing in autorotation.

George
wrote in message
...

I still seriously doubt that such a craft would be practical or even
possible. Is there video of this model flying on the net somewhere?

In any case, simply adding wings to the side of a helicopter will
increase its maximum forward speed significantly without the nead for
a heavy disk and complex control systems.

Dennis.

"George Vranek" wrote:

When flying forward, the Diskrotor Helicopter disk plane has a positive
pitch angle relative to the ground. The thrust necessary for forward
flight
is provided by the jet stream and not by the rotor as a conventional
helicopter does. A model acc.to your proposal has flown stright and
level 5
years ago. The disk airfoil has similar abilities as a conventional
airfoil
with a partially open split flap, which are surprisingly good. See Ira
H.
Abbot: Theory of Wing Sections or similar.

George

wrote in message
...
"George Vranek" wrote:

helicopters. Please have a look at www.vranek.ch/diskrotor.htm and
publish

The diskrotor/diskCopter has been discussed here before. The
conclusion was that it was impractical and probably impossible. When
flying forward, the normal helicopter disk plane has a negative pitch
angle relative to the ground. Putting a huge round airfoil up there
with a negative pitch angle would make you crash and not fly faster.
Not only that, but the disk "airfoil" would not really be a very good
airfoil with the same shape on both ends would it. If you disagree, I
suggest you build a model and fly it faster than 100 mph and see what
happens.

Dennis.


Dennis Hawkins
n4mwd AT amsat DOT org (humans know what to do)

"A RECESSION is when you know somebody who is out of work.
A DEPRESSION is when YOU are out of work.
A RECOVERY is when all the H-1B's are out of work."
To find out what an H-1B is and how they are putting
Americans out of work, visit the following web site
and click on the "Exporting America" CNN news video:
http://zazona.com/ShameH1B/MediaClips.htm




Dennis Hawkins
n4mwd AT amsat DOT org (humans know what to do)

"A RECESSION is when you know somebody who is out of work.
A DEPRESSION is when YOU are out of work.
A RECOVERY is when all the H-1B's are out of work."
To find out what an H-1B is and how they are putting
Americans out of work, visit the following web site
and click on the "Exporting America" CNN news video:
http://zazona.com/ShameH1B/MediaClips.htm

Any extra weight, including wings, will act as ballast. The thing is
that if you want a fast helicopter, you have to pay for it somehow.
That big disk on top of your diskcopter is a heck of a huge ballast
too.

The simplest way to make a helicopter go faster is to simply increase
the rotor rpm. That way, the differential of lift as the helicopter
goes faster and faster is less significant than a slower turning
rotor. That is, at 400 mph tip speed and at 100 mph forward velocity,
you have a 200 mph differential or 50% of the tip speed. At 1000 mph
tip speed, you still have a 200 mph differential speed but its only
20% of the tip speed.

So in this example, a helicopter with a 1000 mph tip speed could go
forward at 250 mph before hitting 50% differential.

I'm not sure what the actual tip speed is, but I know that a lot of
modern fully articulated systems run at tip speeds just under the
speed of sound in order to significantly reduce the chances of ground
resonance.

Dennis.

"George Vranek" wrote:

I am sorry, but there is no video of this model. Nearly each helicopter
company has made trials with adding wings to their machines and all dropped
them again. During the hoverig the additional wing acts as a balast only and
reduces the hover efficiency of the machine. The heavy disk is able to store
a lot of kinetic energy, which allows vertical landing in autorotation.

Dennis Hawkins
n4mwd AT amsat DOT org (humans know what to do)

"A RECESSION is when you know somebody who is out of work.
A DEPRESSION is when YOU are out of work.
A RECOVERY is when all the H-1B's are out of work."
To find out what an H-1B is and how they are putting
Americans out of work, visit the following web site
and click on the "Exporting America" CNN news video:
http://zazona.com/ShameH1B/MediaClips.htm