Tires again (but this time on the tow vehicle)

Michael,
You will get the same response at the mercedes dealer. twenty years ago they
would sell a german produced tow hitch kit for any model and now they don't
want to talk about it.
If pressed they will refer you to a local hitch fabricator and only say that
they have other customers who have used them.
If you know about it to ask, there is a small shop handbook which covers all
of the production models worldwide and gives various specifications for
repair, alignment, and interchange parts, etc. You can find that widely
different wheels, springs, tires, shocks etc. are used in other countries
depending on installed equipment and intended use. It seems that the cars
shipped to OZ are the most ruggedized. The Aussie trailering springs I
ordered were in stock in a warehouse one day away and the dealer was happy
to sell the parts for an independent shop to install. You may find a similar
situation with the VW if you can find a guru.
Yes, the tort lawyers have screwed up things again IMNSHO.
Of course they may end up being the only ones around with enough money to
buy one of the new gliders coming out of europe.
Cheers!


"Michael McNulty" wrote in message
news:S6XMd.27890$mt.18900@fed1read03...

"Papa3" wrote in message
oups.com...
The Passat is a fantastic tow vehicle. With a curb weight of around
3800 lbs, all-wheel drive, stiff suspension, low CG, and a relatively
short coupling between hitch and rear axle, it's a great compromise
between tow vehicle and every day transportation. And with highway
mileage of about 25 (versus what - 16 for the Dodge?), I can still
afford to take a tow when I get to the airport! (and no, I don't really
tow at 75mph, but it is [was] no problem if I needed to for short
bursts with the old setup).

P3


A few years ago I too thought that the Passat wagon looked like a good
choice to tow a glider trailer. When I went to look into buying one I
found
out that "Volkswagon recommends that you don't use this vehicle for
towing".
I first thought that the dealer was full of it, so I called Volkswagon
myself and, after being handed off a few times, got the definitive answer
that "we (VW) do not recommend that the Passat (or Jetta) be used for
towing
and we do not publish any recomended trailer weight limit." Now, I
certainly won't argue with someone who says that he has had good results
using a Passat to tow, but I personally tend to believe the manufacture
when
they say that you should not use their automobile for towing.
(This is in the US; perhaps in Europe VW gives a different story.)

Does anyone have experience towing with a Subaru Outback (2005 model
especially)? It bests the Passat wagon in most of the specs that I care
about, including price, and it is rated to tow 2700 lbs (1225 kg).

"Stefan" wrote in message
...
Michael McNulty wrote:

they say that you should not use their automobile for towing.
(This is in the US; perhaps in Europe VW gives a different story.)

Looking at the outcome of some liability lawsuits in the US, I'm surprized
that there are still manufactorers which recommend their product for
*anything*.

Stefan

Do you actually know anything about the legal system in the US, driving in
the US, or anything else in the US, or, are you just a inclined to
reflexively bash any mention of anything America?

"Pete Reinhart" wrote in message
...
Michael,
You will get the same response at the mercedes dealer. twenty years ago
they
would sell a german produced tow hitch kit for any model and now they
don't
want to talk about it.

snip

From what I've read, while Mercedes does give a tow rating for many of their
cars sold in German, they limit the speed while towing to either 55 mph or
62 mph (100 km/h). This is really not suitable for highway use in the
Western United States.

I have plenty of choices of when I buy a car. I don't need to buy one that
the manufacturer says is not suitable for my intended use.

Michael,

I went through the same rigamarole with VW US (which, by the way, has
just an awful reputation for warranty and other support - so I'm not
surprised). On the other hand, my cousin in Germany tows gliders with
an Audi A6 Variant, and he's about as anal as it gets when it comes to
following "ze rules." So, I stopped in at a VW dealer in Germany
when I was there a few years back. Not only do they publish numbers
for towing (similar to the Australian numbers posted above - something
like 1250kg) but they had in-stock an awesome tow hitch setup. It
requires pulling the rear bumper to install, but it provides a truly
integrated receiver hitch. Unfortunately, it would have cost an arm
and a leg to ship here, which does bring up another issue...

The aftermarket tow hitches available for the Passat in the US are a
joke. They require some serious re-engineering to make them suitable
for towing anything other than a Sunfish boat and trailer. Luckily,
one of the local Soaring gurus is also a fabrication wizard, and with
judicious use of doublers and new bolt patterns, we have a successful
setup. But, if I were to do it again, I'd find a way to get the
European hitch system shipped here.

Finally, one of the guys in my club has an Outback (2004, I think), and
he's very satisfied with it as a towing vehicle. I couldn't get over
the handling (I use the car for a lot of highway driving other than
towing) and the looks (which are better in the newer models), otherwise
I'd be driving an Outback right now.

P3

I just posted a similar thought in response to Michael's note, above.
A suggestion for folks in the US might be to leverage the soaring
community in other countries to do their research there. Every time
I've been at a glider operation in Germany, I've seen tow hitches that
blow the doors off of anything you can get in the States mounted on
cars that I've been told "cannot possibly tow a glider trailer."
Granted, many of the towing distances are shorter, but the Autobahn and
the Alps equal anything we have here in terms of testing towing
capability...

On a humorous note, the paid placement ad that's showing up right over
here -- is from Dalan Hitches, maker of the aftermarket hitch for
my Passat that I so roundly criticized in the prior posting.

Michael McNulty wrote:

From what I've read, while Mercedes does give a tow rating for many of their
cars sold in German, they limit the speed while towing to either 55 mph or
62 mph (100 km/h). This is really not suitable for highway use in the
Western United States.


Mere curiosity, what is the speed limit in the US highways? I was under the
impression it was rather low.

I have plenty of choices of when I buy a car. I don't need to buy one that
the manufacturer says is not suitable for my intended use.




--

Michel TALON

"Michel Talon" wrote in message
...
Michael McNulty wrote:

From what I've read, while Mercedes does give a tow rating for many of
their
cars sold in German, they limit the speed while towing to either 55 mph
or
62 mph (100 km/h). This is really not suitable for highway use in the
Western United States.


Mere curiosity, what is the speed limit in the US highways? I was under
the
impression it was rather low.


It depends on the state you're in and whether your in an urban or rural
area. Where I live the major highways, outside of citys, are usually 75 mph
(121 km/h). But then, of course the typical speed on these roads is 85 mph.
Some states (Montana, Nevada?), few years ago at least, had no limits.

they limit the speed while towing to either 55 mph or
62 mph (100 km/h). This is really not suitable for highway use in the
Western United States.

Mere curiosity, what is the speed limit in the US highways? I was under
the
impression it was rather low.

Michel TALON

The "posted" speed limits in the Western US are 75m/h = 120km/h.
I may have seen 80m/h as well but I can not remember for sure.
The "normal" cruising speeds are about 85 - 90m/h ~ 140km.
In the Eastern parts of the US it ranges from 60 to 70m/h
This allows for a cruising speed of 70 to 80 m/h =115 to 128km/h.
Unlike Europe, specifically Germany, we are able to maintain a very good
average speed in North America. When visiting Germany I find
when driving on the Autobahn the average speed is lower
then one would expect. This deception is cause by the occasional burst
of that famous unlimited speed on the Autobahn.
One other interesting thing, that has not been mentioned, is the fact
we over here, Canada&US,have to "compete" directly with the large trucks
that have no problem diving at speeds of 120km/h. In Europe If I remember
correctly the trucks are limited to between 80 and 100km/h.

One other thing relating to more powerful tow vehicles.
A Gliding friend of my is very happy with his Jetta station wagon Turbo
Diesel
here in Canada. He says it is very comfortable towing a cobra trailer.
It is powerful enough and it has enough torque for a quick getup and go.
Regards
Udo

Michael McNulty wrote:

Mere curiosity, what is the speed limit in the US highways? I was under
the
impression it was rather low.



It depends on the state you're in and whether your in an urban or rural
area. Where I live the major highways, outside of citys, are usually 75 mph
(121 km/h). But then, of course the typical speed on these roads is 85 mph.
Some states (Montana, Nevada?), few years ago at least, had no limits.

Is the trailer limit the same as the car limit, or is it lower?

Michael McNulty wrote:


From what I've read, while Mercedes does give a tow rating for many of their
cars sold in German, they limit the speed while towing to either 55 mph or
62 mph (100 km/h). This is really not suitable for highway use in the
Western United States.

On California highways, the speed limit for trailers never is above 55 mph.


I have plenty of choices of when I buy a car. I don't need to buy one that
the manufacturer says is not suitable for my intended use.

If you are a stickler for manufacturer's recommendations, I suppose you
also are a stickler for speed limits? If so, at least in California, a
car limited to towing at 55 mph should not be a problem.