IFR in the 1930's

"Badwater Bill" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 30 Aug 2003 16:26:02 GMT, "Bill Daniels"
wrote:

As a geezer who learned to fly "blind" with needle, ball and airspeed I
can
say that in a slow, stable aircraft, that those are enough for rather
precise instrument flight. I can still fly a respectable partial panel
NDB
approach with just those instruments + an altimeter. (BTW, I HATE a turn
coordinator.)

For me an attitude indicator and a DG are just icing on the cake.

Bill Daniels

I agree with you Bill. The absolute minimum is a needle and ball,
airspeed, altimeter and compass. I like a few extras myself. If I
could only have one more instrument it would be a DG. If I could have
two, it would be a DG then a horizon. I also hate turn coodinators.
Pieces of crap. The turn needle is much better.

BWB

I should have said, "Needle, ball, airspeed, altimeter, CLOCK and wet
compass". Everything depended on being able to read a bouncing wet compass
and timing turns exactly.

Today we have all these fancy gadgets but most of the time we still depend
on the old wet compass for heading data. Every figured what you would do if
the wet compass goes TA while you are in the soup and all you have is a
manually set DG? Been there.

Bill Daniels

Today we have all these fancy gadgets but most of the time we still depend
on the old wet compass for heading data. Every figured what you would do if
the wet compass goes TA while you are in the soup and all you have is a
manually set DG? Been there.


It's not in the soup, but I've been out in the wild boonies of the Razorbacks
in western Arkansas, second week of December, single seat turbine ag plane, no
heat, no defrost, no windscreen wiper, nothing. I had a five hundred foot
ceiling and one mile visibility, temp. 33 degrees in misting rain. That had me
on my toes, from cold as much as anything, but I wasn't overly worried yet.
Then I started picking up ice. Not bad (as if it could ever be *good*), but my
spidey sense was definitely starting to tingle. I'd go through a thermocline
and pick some up, then warmer air and it would immediately melt. Garmin 195
loses sat lock, pull out the back up Garmin Pilot III, no joy, last resort,
pull out the Palm Pilot with the Delorme GPS which won't work either. No
attitude instruments of any type, no DG, no VOR, no radios but an Icom A-22
with a rubber duckie antenna and the wet compass won't move but a few degrees
no matter what due to the field thrown by the starter/generator. I'll never
forget it, I was flying east and it was stuck on 240 degrees. Hehe, I have
been in more comforting situations. Luckily I just happened to pick out a set
of railroad tracks that led me right to what I think was the most beautiful
airport I've ever seen in Mena, AR. Man, I love to fly, but sometimes it's
damn good to be on the ground.

. Man, I love to fly, but sometimes it's
damn good to be on the ground.

Yep. Here's a good one for ya. I was 16 years old in an Aeronica
Champ 85 and decided to fly to the Grand Canyon from Boulder City
Nevada. I had about 40 hours at the time. There were a few clouds,
but nothing heavy. I motored toward the Grand Canyon south rim
airport at about 2000 feet AGL. As I got closer and my fuel got to be
less, the clouds got to be more. I did have a radio of all things and
the ground told me they had a broken to overcast ceiling of nearly
1500 feet. I had climbed to about 3000 agl by that time and was stuck
on top. I knew the terrain sloped down toward the south and I also
knew that the alcohol compass leads the turn when you point south. I
got about 500 feet above the clouds and held a heading of exactly
south...got her all trimmed up so she was on a 500 ft/min decent with
my hands off the stick. I let go completely and drove that litte
champ with my feet, ever so lightly, holding that big "S" in the
compass window. Slight changes in heading caused the compass to
really lead and it was real sensitive. I just held it with all my
concentration as I entered the clouds. And it was smooth that day too
so this really worked well. I was in the clouds for what seemed like
an eternity. Then after many minutes, it seemed, I popped out and saw
the airport to my 9 o'clock position.

Got lucky once more. Ha!

Badwater "Don't need no damn turn coordinator" Bill

"Badwater Bill" wrote in message
...
. Man, I love to fly, but sometimes it's
damn good to be on the ground.

Yep. Here's a good one for ya. I was 16 years old in an Aeronica
Champ 85 and decided to fly to the Grand Canyon from Boulder City
Nevada. I had about 40 hours at the time. There were a few clouds,
but nothing heavy. I motored toward the Grand Canyon south rim
airport at about 2000 feet AGL. As I got closer and my fuel got to be
less, the clouds got to be more. I did have a radio of all things and
the ground told me they had a broken to overcast ceiling of nearly
1500 feet. I had climbed to about 3000 agl by that time and was stuck
on top. I knew the terrain sloped down toward the south and I also
knew that the alcohol compass leads the turn when you point south. I
got about 500 feet above the clouds and held a heading of exactly
south...got her all trimmed up so she was on a 500 ft/min decent with
my hands off the stick. I let go completely and drove that litte
champ with my feet, ever so lightly, holding that big "S" in the
compass window. Slight changes in heading caused the compass to
really lead and it was real sensitive. I just held it with all my
concentration as I entered the clouds. And it was smooth that day too
so this really worked well. I was in the clouds for what seemed like
an eternity. Then after many minutes, it seemed, I popped out and saw
the airport to my 9 o'clock position.

Got lucky once more. Ha!

Badwater "Don't need no damn turn coordinator" Bill




I believe the statue of limits is out on this:

About two weeks after I successfully got my private, I took off on a 3200
mile x-country.

At various times: VOR failed, Comms failed, gasolator failed, alternator
failed, burning wire under panel. I also managed to set up an approach to
the wrong airport in controlled airspace (OKC, no less and who knew there
were so many damned airports in that area!). I also got my first tast of
IFR--stuck on top--and handled exactly as you described yours. Thank god
there are no mountains in Kansas. I almost forgot, on the last leg, just 40
miles from home, I got caught in between two T-Cells that grew together. I
seriously thought about planting the damned thing on the highway under me.

That which doesn't kill us, makes us stronger!

I could have written about a years worth of 'I learned about flying from
that"

My flying of the last seven or eight years has been remarkably boring in
comparison.

In article et, Bill Daniels wrote:

Every figured what you would do if
the wet compass goes TA while you are in the soup and all you have is a
manually set DG? Been there.

Declare an emergency and request a no-gyro approach. If I'm out
of radar coverage, then I guess I'd just start compensating for drift
as though there were wind, even though it's really precession error.
That would get kind of difficult eventually, so I might be tempted to
reset it based on what I thought the winds really were when I appeared
to be tracking a course accurately. It probably wouldn't be any
worse afterwards....

Did you have some suggestions in mind when you asked the
question? If so, I for one would like to hear them.

Regards,

Mike

"Mike Beede" wrote in message
...
In article et, Bill
Daniels wrote:

Every figured what you would do if
the wet compass goes TA while you are in the soup and all you have is a
manually set DG? Been there.

Declare an emergency and request a no-gyro approach. If I'm out
of radar coverage, then I guess I'd just start compensating for drift
as though there were wind, even though it's really precession error.
That would get kind of difficult eventually, so I might be tempted to
reset it based on what I thought the winds really were when I appeared
to be tracking a course accurately. It probably wouldn't be any
worse afterwards....

Did you have some suggestions in mind when you asked the
question? If so, I for one would like to hear them.

Regards,

Mike

I declared an emergency and requested a no-gyro approach as you suggested -
even though I had gyros. Then, because I had quite a ways to go to the
first IFR runway, I figured out that the GPS ground track was almost as good
as a wet compass. I just set the DG to the GPS ground track and ignored
wind - which worked as long as I didn't change heading often. That got me
into approach's radar coverage and the no-gyro approach worked from there.

My CFII had told me that there was no backup for a wet compass because "they
never fail" - baloney, the glass cracked and all the fluid ran down the
instrument panel. After that, it wouldn't move. Made me think.

Bill Daniels

Bill

You talk about the 'wet' compass. Used to be called a 'whiskey'
compass because it had whiskey as the damping fluid in it. It also
served as a nerve steadier if you crashed and 'walked away' as you
could open and get a snort while waiting for rescue G

Big John


On Sun, 31 Aug 2003 02:07:34 GMT, "Bill Daniels"
wrote:


----clip----

My CFII had told me that there was no backup for a wet compass because "they
never fail" - baloney, the glass cracked and all the fluid ran down the
instrument panel. After that, it wouldn't move. Made me think.

Bill Daniels