Genesis 2 For Sale

Peter F wrote:
At 02:42 08 February 2007, Steve Davis wrote:
Discus 2 performance at a fraction of the cost.

That would be why there was so many flying at the last
Std Class World Champs then..

And why there was so many flying at the Std Class Worlds
when the original Discus was the class of the field.



41 Discus 2 A & B in the US

6 flew in 2006 Senior Contest, Seminole Lake Gliderport, Florida


23 Genesis II in the US

2 flew in 2006 Senior Contest, Seminole Lake Gliderport, Florida


That's a reasonable representation.

Those old guys know how to get the most for their money.



Jack

Peter,

Well, it's winter, I'll bite.

Speaking of the Worlds, Clem Bowman was getting ready to take one to
the Worlds - unfortunately that never happened.

I'll defer to the opinions of Karl Striedieck, Bill Bartell, JJ
Sinclair, David Mercer, Bob Salvo and Ron Gaynier. I believe all have
won contest days with the ship.

Dick Johnson's flight test (online at ssa.org, I believe) has a nice
polar and a performance evaluation if you are interested. He even has
overlay comparisons with a Discus to make it easy.


Ever flown one?

Mike Brooks

On Feb 8, 3:50 am, wrote:

Ever flown one?

It seems a bit of a stretch to claim the Genesis is as good as the
Discus 2. I raced a lot with a local Genesis pilot and you couldn't
convince me, or him, that was true.

Contest results are not always a good indication of glider performance
though. A tiny perceived difference in performance will have all the
top pilots flying one or two types and they will win. If you put that
group of pilots in a different glider type they would still win.

I flew the prototype Genesis at Uvalde, liked it, but didn't buy one.

Andy

On Feb 8, 9:58 am, "Andy" wrote:
On Feb 8, 3:50 am, wrote:

Ever flown one?

It seems a bit of a stretch to claim the Genesis is as good as the
Discus 2. I raced a lot with a local Genesis pilot and you couldn't
convince me, or him, that was true.

Contest results are not always a good indication of glider performance
though. A tiny perceived difference in performance will have all the
top pilots flying one or two types and they will win. If you put that
group of pilots in a different glider type they would still win.

I flew the prototype Genesis at Uvalde, liked it, but didn't buy one.

Andy

Maybe. What were your experiences, then? Were you ahead in the high-
speed cruise, the climb, or both? Ballasted or dry?

Agreed that if you put top pilots in a different machine, they'll
still win. We're talking a few percent one way or the other here. In
my case at least, the ship is not the limiting factor. It's something
to talk about until the season starts up, though....

Mike

Jack wrote:
Peter F wrote:
At 02:42 08 February 2007, Steve Davis wrote:
Discus 2 performance at a fraction of the cost.

That would be why there was so many flying at the last
Std Class World Champs then..

41 Discus 2 A & B in the US

6 flew in 2006 Senior Contest, Seminole Lake Gliderport, Florida

23 Genesis II in the US

2 flew in 2006 Senior Contest, Seminole Lake Gliderport, Florida

That's a reasonable representation.

Sure, but the real question is (was) - if the Genesis 2 is as good as a
Discus 2, why aren't there more G2's?

Tony V.

On Feb 8, 8:12 am, Tony Verhulst wrote:
Jack wrote:
Peter F wrote:
At 02:42 08 February 2007, Steve Davis wrote:
Discus 2 performance at a fraction of the cost.

That would be why there was so many flying at the last
Std Class World Champs then..

41 Discus 2 A & B in the US

6 flew in 2006 Senior Contest, Seminole Lake Gliderport, Florida

23 Genesis II in the US

2 flew in 2006 Senior Contest, Seminole Lake Gliderport, Florida

That's a reasonable representation.

Sure, but the real question is (was) - if the Genesis 2 is as good as a
Discus 2, why aren't there more G2's?

Tony V.

Good question. I think there are a lot of variables involved here.
For one, the G2 is an unorthodox design, and I think we've seen that
in many different aircraft that tends to lead to low production
numbers. Beech Starship comes to mind.

Clem Bowman's accident certainly must have had some effect on orders.
We will never know what would have happened had he continued his
successful racing career in the G2.

Otherwise - there are plenty of designs that were successful
sailplanes but had limited production runs. How about the Sisu? The
number of units produced is not necessarily a good metric of the
absolute value of a glider.

The G2 can be debated in a number of ways. Some people just don't
like they way they look - fair enough. That's personal taste. But if
you have a look at the numbers (and maybe even fly one), I think the
reason for the low production number lies outside the performance
realm and gets into the area of manufacturing issues. My hat is off to
the people that worked hard to produce them.

Mike Brooks