The Differences Between PPLicensing And Learning

Dudley Henriques wrote:
I would respectfully disagree with this analysis based on hundreds of
hours spent working with both primary students, flight instructors,
and Microsoft.
Sims have their use, but if used before solo can actually be
detrimental for various reasons, some of them absolutely critical to
student progress. After solo, and when used with the proper
supervision, the sims have their productive side as well.

Hmmm. That seems to be a stronger statement about pre-solo use than I've
seen you state in the recent past. Or maybe I'm over-extending "pre-solo"
to include "pre-flight-training" that you didn't intend? That is, if time
is split thusly:

Big Bang - birth - simming - initial flight training - solo - PPL -
death - Big Crunch

Then that order is okay so long as simming and pre-solo flight training
don't overlap? Or you believe simming is _only_ a net positive use after
solo and even then only under supervision? Hmmm.

Otherwise your advice appears to be at odds with what Bruce Williams wrote
in his book "Microsoft Flight Simulator as a Training Aid." That is, while
he too says pre-solo simming _can_ be detrimental, it appears he believes
that is not an immutable issue and lays out some guidelines that he
believes can make pre-flight training use a net positive. But I guess that
is not surprising, given that he wrote a book on the subject!

(There seem to be anecdotes posted by people who have felt use of MS Flight
Simulator helped them get a leg-up in their training and others who felt MS
FS actually slowed them down.)

(There seem to be anecdotes posted by people who have felt use of MS Flight
Simulator helped them get a leg-up in their training and others who felt MS
FS actually slowed them down.)

It all depends on your approach to flying. If you think a pilot's
primary instruments are the Artificial Horizon, the ASI, the tachometer
and a myriade of other gauges, then a sim will probably help. But if you
believe that a pilot's primary instruments are the natural horizon, his
butt and the feel of the controls, then a sim will most definitely slow
down a student's progress and may even bring it to a halt.

Jim Logajan wrote:
Dudley Henriques wrote:
I would respectfully disagree with this analysis based on hundreds of
hours spent working with both primary students, flight instructors,
and Microsoft.
Sims have their use, but if used before solo can actually be
detrimental for various reasons, some of them absolutely critical to
student progress. After solo, and when used with the proper
supervision, the sims have their productive side as well.

Hmmm. That seems to be a stronger statement about pre-solo use than I've
seen you state in the recent past. Or maybe I'm over-extending "pre-solo"
to include "pre-flight-training" that you didn't intend? That is, if time
is split thusly:

Big Bang - birth - simming - initial flight training - solo - PPL -
death - Big Crunch

Then that order is okay so long as simming and pre-solo flight training
don't overlap? Or you believe simming is _only_ a net positive use after
solo and even then only under supervision? Hmmm.

Otherwise your advice appears to be at odds with what Bruce Williams wrote
in his book "Microsoft Flight Simulator as a Training Aid." That is, while
he too says pre-solo simming _can_ be detrimental, it appears he believes
that is not an immutable issue and lays out some guidelines that he
believes can make pre-flight training use a net positive. But I guess that
is not surprising, given that he wrote a book on the subject!

(There seem to be anecdotes posted by people who have felt use of MS Flight
Simulator helped them get a leg-up in their training and others who felt MS
FS actually slowed them down.)

You are mistaken in your analysis.
My opinions on this issue are quite well known and what I have said here
is in no way conflictive with any earlier opinion. I did however OMIT
part of that opinion by not including that I see no objection at all to
the sim being used BEFORE dual commences as well as after solo, so the
actual envelope I have always stressed constitutes ommission of the
simulator between the first hour of dual instruction and solo. After
solo, the sim can again be used and has specific advantages.
There is no doubt at all in my mind that people coming into dual
instruction after being exposed to the simulator have an advantage, but
considering this, I still stress leaving the sim alone between first
dual and solo for the exact reasons I've given.
You mentioned Bruce Williams book on the sim as a training tool.
I believe Mr. Williams and I are in a fair amount of agreement on how
the sim can be used by flight instructors as a training aid. In fact,
Bruce sent me the book to review. I did that for ASA and you will find a
link to my review on Bruce Williams web site.
If you wish, you may shortcut directly to that review by going to
www.simflight.com and searching my name. You will find it there.


--
Dudley Henriques

Dudley Henriques wrote:
You are mistaken in your analysis.

I am indeed. :-(

My opinions on this issue are quite well known and what I have said
here is in no way conflictive with any earlier opinion. I did however
OMIT part of that opinion by not including that I see no objection at
all to the sim being used BEFORE dual commences as well as after solo,
so the actual envelope I have always stressed constitutes ommission of
the simulator between the first hour of dual instruction and solo.

That is as I remembered your past statements. It seems I read more into
your earlier posting than what you actually wrote. Oops.

After solo, the sim can again be used and has specific advantages.
There is no doubt at all in my mind that people coming into dual
instruction after being exposed to the simulator have an advantage,
but considering this, I still stress leaving the sim alone between
first dual and solo for the exact reasons I've given.
You mentioned Bruce Williams book on the sim as a training tool.
I believe Mr. Williams and I are in a fair amount of agreement on how
the sim can be used by flight instructors as a training aid. In fact,
Bruce sent me the book to review. I did that for ASA and you will find
a link to my review on Bruce Williams web site.
If you wish, you may shortcut directly to that review by going to
www.simflight.com and searching my name. You will find it there.

I've read your review. Thank you.

Have you had an opportunity to look through the book "Microsoft Flight
Simulator X for Pilots: Real-World Training" by Jeff Van West and Kevin
Lane-cummings? If so, any thoughts you'd be willing to share on it?

Jim Logajan wrote:

I've read your review. Thank you.

No problem. You're welcome.

Have you had an opportunity to look through the book "Microsoft Flight
Simulator X for Pilots: Real-World Training" by Jeff Van West and Kevin
Lane-cummings? If so, any thoughts you'd be willing to share on it?

I'm sorry I haven't. I would say without reading it that if they are
basically in line with Williams I would have no problem with it.
As I've said, MSFS in the hands of a good creative instructor should
prove to be a positive visual training tool.
The only caveat I have with any simulator is the one I have stated
concerning the period between first dual and solo.
I enjoy the sim myself and have opted to retain FS2004 rather than go to
FSX for various reasons.

--
Dudley Henriques

On Thu, 28 Feb 2008 20:29:58 -0500, Dudley Henriques wrote:

I enjoy the sim myself and have opted to retain FS2004 rather than go to
FSX for various reasons.

A couple quick ones in favor of both?
--
Remove numbers for gmail and for God's sake it ain't "gee" either!

WJRFlyBoy wrote:
On Thu, 28 Feb 2008 20:29:58 -0500, Dudley Henriques wrote:

I enjoy the sim myself and have opted to retain FS2004 rather than go to
FSX for various reasons.

A couple quick ones in favor of both?

FS2004 is a superior product. I find no positives for FSX.

--
Dudley Henriques

During my primary training the biggest difficulty I had was sensing the
proper hight above runway where to begin the flare. I was really stuck there
for almost a month, either flaring too high, or landing flat. My instructor
was pretty much desperate, and I started thinking that I'm perhaps lacking
some physical ability to do that right.
What I did was, I set up MSFS with a projector and a wall-mounted screen in
my room, put the projector far enough to get the image of the exact 1:1
scale of what I see out of cockpit, and set up the plane on a very short
final, perhaps 10-12 seconds before touchdown. I was then practicing
the flare with this setup; I did around fifteen hundred flares in one week.
That helped me tremendously. I'm pretty sure that probably there were
other ways to break this plateau I had, but this one worked for me. I hardly
ever fired MSFS ever since, I got so sick of it

Andrey


In rec.aviation.piloting Dudley Henriques wrote:
[...]
part of that opinion by not including that I see no objection at all to
the sim being used BEFORE dual commences as well as after solo, so the
actual envelope I have always stressed constitutes ommission of the
simulator between the first hour of dual instruction and solo. After
solo, the sim can again be used and has specific advantages.
[...]

Andrey Serbinenko wrote:
During my primary training the biggest difficulty I had was sensing the
proper hight above runway where to begin the flare. I was really stuck there
for almost a month, either flaring too high, or landing flat. My instructor
was pretty much desperate, and I started thinking that I'm perhaps lacking
some physical ability to do that right.
What I did was, I set up MSFS with a projector and a wall-mounted screen in
my room, put the projector far enough to get the image of the exact 1:1
scale of what I see out of cockpit, and set up the plane on a very short
final, perhaps 10-12 seconds before touchdown. I was then practicing
the flare with this setup; I did around fifteen hundred flares in one week.
That helped me tremendously. I'm pretty sure that probably there were
other ways to break this plateau I had, but this one worked for me. I hardly
ever fired MSFS ever since, I got so sick of it

Andrey


In rec.aviation.piloting Dudley Henriques wrote:
[...]
part of that opinion by not including that I see no objection at all to
the sim being used BEFORE dual commences as well as after solo, so the
actual envelope I have always stressed constitutes ommission of the
simulator between the first hour of dual instruction and solo. After
solo, the sim can again be used and has specific advantages.
[...]

A very simple instructor technique for a student having the problem you
had is for the instructor to "fly" the airplane up the runway holding it
in the landing attitude just inches off the ground. By doing this, the
student gets a long look at the correct visual cue both over the nose
and peripherally for the airplane in a landing attitude.
Also, as the airplane is positioned for takeoff and before the throttle
is opened, the student should be told to look over the nose and remember
that visual cue. This is the cue that will be seen as the aircraft
touches down again.
There are many ways in the airplane to solve the problem you had. I
would never in a million years allow any student of mine to use MSFS to
solve the issue you were having.


--
Dudley Henriques

On Thu, 28 Feb 2008 22:42:13 -0000, Jim Logajan wrote:

Bruce Williams wrote
in his book "Microsoft Flight Simulator as a Training Aid." That is, while
he too says pre-solo simming _can_ be detrimental,

Damn, I could have read that, duh on my part...
--
Remove numbers for gmail and for God's sake it ain't "gee" either!