Parachute 20 year limit

Tuno wrote:

I would very like to know who you spoke to in March.

Unfortunately, I tossed my contact notes when I bought my parachute in
April, and my memory of who said what is poor. I can tell you I
definitely spoke to Strong, Paraphernalia, Tim Mara (who's offered
opinions here already), and I am pretty sure National, and I know I had
some contact with Allen Silver (but possibly not about ram-airs).

I also looked closely at this parachute:

http://www.parachuteshop.com/aviator..._parachute.htm

but this note (and also from reading the manual, as I remember), put me
off the idea:

"Because of the advanced characteristics of these canopy designs, the
Sport Aviator model may only be used by individuals who either have
ram-air jumping experience such as skydiving, or have received special
training in the use and performance of these canopies."

I also looked at Performance Design reserves, but they seemed to be for
even more experienced jumpers, and not people looking for "pilot
emergency parachutes".

Though I am not
surprised that a manufacturer would encourage you to stick with a
round chute -- they make money selling you either kind, and think that
they assume a liability risk if they do anything but tell an
"untrained jumper" to use a round parachute.

I can't assess that factor. They all seemed sincere, cautious, and
offered what seemed like sensible reasons for their recommendations.


The fact is, "square parachutes require training". But consider the
target audiences -- just about anybody can go make a parachute jump.
Licensed glider pilots have a FAR higher general compentency level
than your average yahoo. (At least in Arizona And I can assure you
that operating square *reserve* parachutes is an EASY thing for glider
pilots to do.

I believe you, but I'm not interested in learning, and I'm not sure I'd
remember it all a few years later, anyway. My final analysis that each
had some advantages for my situation, leading it to be a wash overall,
so I went with price and known comfort to pick the mini-Softie.

And, while all this is interesting discussion, my guess is getting
everyone to switch to ram-airs would not increase "emergency bail-out
safety" near as much as getting everyone to install a Roeger hook. But
that's another thread...

--
Eric Greenwell - Washington State, USA
* Change "netto" to "net" to email me directly

* Updated! "Transponders in Sailplanes" http://tinyurl.com/y739x4
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But from the manufacturor's website:
http://www.rigginginnovations.com/products/aviator.htm

"The 246 and 280 sq ft canopies have a unique modulated control
system, which allows for their use by aircrew personnel with minimal
additional training required over and above what they receive on
current round parachute systems."

That doesn't sound like a big barrier to use.

The only real barrier (IMHO) is the price difference.

Todd Smith
3S

This has been an interesting discussion, but it is easy to become confused
by the fact that a high speed chute is designed to delay opening, and a
low speed chute is designed to open quickly, if I understand correctly.
Apparently the word speed refers to aircraft speed at egress and has
nothing to do with rapidity of deployment. Did I get that right?


At 03:47 11 December 2008, toad wrote:
But from the manufacturor's website:
http://www.rigginginnovations.com/products/aviator.htm

"The 246 and 280 sq ft canopies have a unique modulated control
system, which allows for their use by aircrew personnel with minimal
additional training required over and above what they receive on
current round parachute systems."

That doesn't sound like a big barrier to use.

The only real barrier (IMHO) is the price difference.

Todd Smith
3S

Nyal -- not quite. "High speed" refers to the maximum velocity when
opening for which the parachute was designed, not for how fast they
open (i.e., strength, not speed). There are high speed mains, high
speed reserves; high speed rounds, well, you get the picture. The
military T-10 is an example of a round, non-high-speed canopy.

Sport reserves are high-speed, but designed for fast opening at any
velocity, the anticipation being that a skydiver might have anything
between a terminal velocity and a low speed deployment, which may
happen after a canopy collision (or for canopy formation skydivers,
the dreaded wrap).

I don't know of any parachutes made today that are not "high speed"
rated. And the square ones, yes, they open FAST.

At 04:30 11 December 2008, Tuno wrote:
Nyal -- not quite. "High speed" refers to the maximum velocity when
opening for which the parachute was designed, not for how fast they
open (i.e., strength, not speed).



That's what I thought I said.

So what is it that these high-speed chutes do to prevent a hideous shock
to the jumper that the low speed chutes don't do?




There are high speed mains, high
speed reserves; high speed rounds, well, you get the picture. The
military T-10 is an example of a round, non-high-speed canopy.

Sport reserves are high-speed, but designed for fast opening at any
velocity, the anticipation being that a skydiver might have anything
between a terminal velocity and a low speed deployment, which may
happen after a canopy collision (or for canopy formation skydivers,
the dreaded wrap).

I don't know of any parachutes made today that are not "high speed"
rated. And the square ones, yes, they open FAST.

Nyal, both high- and low-speed parachutes (talking emergency type
squares here) use the same kind of reefing system for deployment. It's
called a slider, a small rectangle of fabric with the chute's
suspensions lines going through a grommet in each corner. The slider
is pulled up and stowed at the top of the suspension lines when packed
(unless you're a BASE jumper). On deployment, it prevents the
parachute from opening instantly; the force of the chute opening
pushes the slider down to the riders (hence the term "slider").
Squares are so good at opening that emergency/reserve squares, which
are packed to open quickly, must have the slider.

2NO

but this note (and also from reading the manual, as I remember),
put me
off the idea:

"Because of the advanced characteristics of these canopy designs, the
Sport Aviator model may only be used by individuals who either have
ram-air jumping experience such as skydiving, or have received special
training in the use and performance of these canopies."

While they do recommend that for the Sport Aviator Model, that is not
the case for them all. They have two different control systems for
their 6 canopy options for the P-124. Four of them require jumping
experience but Two do they just say "minimum additional training"
Calling Rigging Innovations would answer exactly what that means.
http://www.rigginginnovations.com/products/aviator.htm

FWIW, I'm waiting for my new Softie to show up, with a good ole'
roundie under the hood. I would however like to do some jumps in the
future (not in my Softie!), at least enough to competently jump solo
since a broken airplane makes a terrible classroom...no matter how old
your chute is, how fast it opens, or whether it is square or round.
Training seems to be the answer to most of aviation's other ills...

-Paul