New Soaring PNA Available

In my experience, XC Soar does't always install easily. Once the
program is running, getting all the files you need (especially
terrain) isn't as simple as with SeeYou PDA or PNA or WinPilot (I've
only installed WP on PDAs). No experience with LK8000. To be honest, I
prefer the $2500 Altair to display XC Soar. Not a touch screen, but
very bright and clear with buttons next to where you would ordinarily
touch. It's necessary to design the panel around it.
There are quite a few cheap Chinese PNAs available in bulk from Hong
Kong, and some even locally as single units. TRKA, how does the less
than $100 unit you bought and configured work? The cheapest ones I've
built would be a Navigon with SeeYouPNA (and a later failure
installing XC Soar on the same device), or a HP 310 with XC Soar. The
Navigon works great, HP too after much suggestion that it's parents
weren't married. It still has no terrain. Neither are particularly
readable.
I heard the XC Soar terrain file generator problem is from having
too large a task area?
Jim

On May 10, 10:42*pm, TRKA wrote:
One question

what makes this device so expensive please?

I see a normal cheap chinese Navigation device with no additional
gear.
Also if this is additional gear it will cost about 10$

So lets calculate

Cheap chinese Navigation device : 60-100$
Additional Gear : 10$
Software : 0$ (XCSoar and LK8000) is FREEWARE

On May 11, 1:15*pm, JS wrote:
* In my experience, XC Soar does't always install easily. Once the
program is running, getting all the files you need (especially
terrain) isn't as simple as with SeeYou PDA or PNA or WinPilot (I've
only installed WP on PDAs). No experience with LK8000. To be honest, I
prefer the $2500 Altair to display XC Soar. Not a touch screen, but
very bright and clear with buttons next to where you would ordinarily
touch. It's necessary to design the panel around it.
* There are quite a few cheap Chinese PNAs available in bulk from Hong
Kong, and some even locally as single units. TRKA, how does the less
than $100 unit you bought and configured work? The cheapest ones I've
built would be a Navigon with SeeYouPNA (and a later failure
installing XC Soar on the same device), or a HP 310 with XC Soar. The
Navigon works great, HP too after much suggestion that it's parents
weren't married. It still has no terrain. Neither are particularly
readable.
* I heard the XC Soar terrain file generator problem is from having
too large a task area?
Jim

On May 10, 10:42*pm, TRKA wrote:

One question

what makes this device so expensive please?

I see a normal cheap chinese Navigation device with no additional
gear.
Also if this is additional gear it will cost about 10$

So lets calculate

Cheap chinese Navigation device : 60-100$
Additional Gear : 10$
Software : 0$ (XCSoar and LK8000) is FREEWARE

Never had a problem installing XCSoar or the terrain data on PDA's or
the MIO C320, which is done by a hack and using a SD card. The MIO is
pretty crummy in daylight though, and Al's statement that his PNA is
better than a HP 39XX in sunlight is interesting. If his device is
indeed more viewable than a 39XX and can be connected to an approved
data logger it becomes a very nice low cost option.

On May 11, 12:33*pm, mike wrote:
On May 11, 1:15*pm, JS wrote:



* In my experience, XC Soar does't always install easily. Once the
program is running, getting all the files you need (especially
terrain) isn't as simple as with SeeYou PDA or PNA or WinPilot (I've
only installed WP on PDAs). No experience with LK8000. To be honest, I
prefer the $2500 Altair to display XC Soar. Not a touch screen, but
very bright and clear with buttons next to where you would ordinarily
touch. It's necessary to design the panel around it.
* There are quite a few cheap Chinese PNAs available in bulk from Hong
Kong, and some even locally as single units. TRKA, how does the less
than $100 unit you bought and configured work? The cheapest ones I've
built would be a Navigon with SeeYouPNA (and a later failure
installing XC Soar on the same device), or a HP 310 with XC Soar. The
Navigon works great, HP too after much suggestion that it's parents
weren't married. It still has no terrain. Neither are particularly
readable.
* I heard the XC Soar terrain file generator problem is from having
too large a task area?
Jim

On May 10, 10:42*pm, TRKA wrote:

One question

what makes this device so expensive please?

I see a normal cheap chinese Navigation device with no additional
gear.
Also if this is additional gear it will cost about 10$

So lets calculate

Cheap chinese Navigation device : 60-100$
Additional Gear : 10$
Software : 0$ (XCSoar and LK8000) is FREEWARE

Never had a problem installing XCSoar or the terrain data on PDA's or
the MIO C320, which is done by a hack and using a SD card. The MIO is
pretty crummy in daylight though, and Al's statement that his PNA is
better than a HP 39XX in sunlight is interesting. If his device is
indeed more viewable than a 39XX and can be connected to an approved
data logger it becomes a very nice low cost option.

Meant to post this last night...

added to silentflights facebook page.. screens ipaq 3850 and SFGC side
by side on my desk last night.
http://www.facebook.com/#!/photo.php...&id=1497266715

Will see if the iphone's crappy camera can convey the same in bight
sunlight.

Cheers

Al

On 11 Mai, 21:52, " wrote:
On May 11, 12:33*pm, mike wrote:



On May 11, 1:15*pm, JS wrote:

* In my experience, XC Soar does't always install easily. Once the
program is running, getting all the files you need (especially
terrain) isn't as simple as with SeeYou PDA or PNA or WinPilot (I've
only installed WP on PDAs). No experience with LK8000. To be honest, I
prefer the $2500 Altair to display XC Soar. Not a touch screen, but
very bright and clear with buttons next to where you would ordinarily
touch. It's necessary to design the panel around it.
* There are quite a few cheap Chinese PNAs available in bulk from Hong
Kong, and some even locally as single units. TRKA, how does the less
than $100 unit you bought and configured work? The cheapest ones I've
built would be a Navigon with SeeYouPNA (and a later failure
installing XC Soar on the same device), or a HP 310 with XC Soar. The
Navigon works great, HP too after much suggestion that it's parents
weren't married. It still has no terrain. Neither are particularly
readable.
* I heard the XC Soar terrain file generator problem is from having
too large a task area?
Jim

On May 10, 10:42*pm, TRKA wrote:

One question

what makes this device so expensive please?

I see a normal cheap chinese Navigation device with no additional
gear.
Also if this is additional gear it will cost about 10$

So lets calculate

Cheap chinese Navigation device : 60-100$
Additional Gear : 10$
Software : 0$ (XCSoar and LK8000) is FREEWARE

Never had a problem installing XCSoar or the terrain data on PDA's or
the MIO C320, which is done by a hack and using a SD card. The MIO is
pretty crummy in daylight though, and Al's statement that his PNA is
better than a HP 39XX in sunlight is interesting. If his device is
indeed more viewable than a 39XX and can be connected to an approved
data logger it becomes a very nice low cost option.

Meant to post this last night...

added to silentflights facebook page.. screens ipaq 3850 and SFGC side
by side on my desk last night.http://www.facebook.com/#!/photo.php...op=1&view=all&...

Will see if the iphone's crappy camera can convey the same in bight
sunlight.

Cheers

Al

This is no real test Sorry. Put them outside and let the sun shine on
both displays.
We dont fly in our office or at home, we fly outside you know!

On May 12, 12:53*am, TRKA wrote:
On 11 Mai, 21:52, " wrote:



On May 11, 12:33*pm, mike wrote:

On May 11, 1:15*pm, JS wrote:

* In my experience, XC Soar does't always install easily. Once the
program is running, getting all the files you need (especially
terrain) isn't as simple as with SeeYou PDA or PNA or WinPilot (I've
only installed WP on PDAs). No experience with LK8000. To be honest, I
prefer the $2500 Altair to display XC Soar. Not a touch screen, but
very bright and clear with buttons next to where you would ordinarily
touch. It's necessary to design the panel around it.
* There are quite a few cheap Chinese PNAs available in bulk from Hong
Kong, and some even locally as single units. TRKA, how does the less
than $100 unit you bought and configured work? The cheapest ones I've
built would be a Navigon with SeeYouPNA (and a later failure
installing XC Soar on the same device), or a HP 310 with XC Soar. The
Navigon works great, HP too after much suggestion that it's parents
weren't married. It still has no terrain. Neither are particularly
readable.
* I heard the XC Soar terrain file generator problem is from having
too large a task area?
Jim

On May 10, 10:42*pm, TRKA wrote:

One question

what makes this device so expensive please?

I see a normal cheap chinese Navigation device with no additional
gear.
Also if this is additional gear it will cost about 10$

So lets calculate

Cheap chinese Navigation device : 60-100$
Additional Gear : 10$
Software : 0$ (XCSoar and LK8000) is FREEWARE

Never had a problem installing XCSoar or the terrain data on PDA's or
the MIO C320, which is done by a hack and using a SD card. The MIO is
pretty crummy in daylight though, and Al's statement that his PNA is
better than a HP 39XX in sunlight is interesting. If his device is
indeed more viewable than a 39XX and can be connected to an approved
data logger it becomes a very nice low cost option.

Meant to post this last night...

added to silentflights facebook page.. screens ipaq 3850 and SFGC side
by side on my desk last night.http://www.facebook.com/#!/photo.php...op=1&view=all&...

Will see if the iphone's crappy camera can convey the same in bight
sunlight.

Cheers

Al

This is no real test Sorry. Put them outside and let the sun shine on
both displays.
We dont fly in our office or at home, we fly outside you know!

I fly in a cockpit... you might have one of those fancy Grunau Baby's
or something with no canopy.

WHAT????

Are you kidding. Put them both in bright sunlight and make a photo.
Everthing else is no real compare. Only Marketing blala

On Tue, 11 May 2010 12:15:51 -0700, JS wrote:

The cheapest ones I've
built would be a Navigon with SeeYouPNA (and a later failure installing
XC Soar on the same device),

Do you know what OS this Navigon runs? The reason I ask is that I have
currently got two Binatone B350 PNAs:

(a) was made in Dec 2009
It runs XCSoar 5.2.4mk and LK8000a9i.
I think this one runs Windows Mobile 5.
Its s/n starts B3510960...
It goes CLANG-CLANG when it has booted up.

(b) was made in Jan 2010
If won't run either XCSoar 5.2.4mk or LK8000a9i.
I know this one runs Windows Mobile 6.00.
Its s/n starts B3511001...
It plays a bar of music (4 beats) when it has booted up.

Listening to the first noise the B350 makes when its cold started it the
easiest way to know which OS it runs. I don't know if the same applies to
other PNAs but, if this is the default Windows Mobile start up noise,
then probably all WM5/WM6 devices do the same.


--
martin@ | Martin Gregorie
gregorie. | Essex, UK
org |

What a laugh!
The Navigon is probably a confused version. Single clang, then 2
bars of music.
Thought if I continued trying to put XC Soar on it, there would be the
clang of it hitting the wall.
The database has 700 or so points and covers at least part of 4
western states, which is what I heard was bad for XC Soar terrain
generator.
Jim

On May 11, 12:41*pm, Martin Gregorie
wrote:

* * It goes CLANG-CLANG when it has booted up.

On Tue, 11 May 2010 18:47:11 -0700, JS wrote:

The Navigon is probably a confused version. Single clang, then 2
bars of music.

That's useful to know: evidently the start-up sound is defined by the
manufacturer and some, such as Binatone, change it from time to time.

Thought if I continued trying to put XC Soar on it, there would be the
clang of it hitting the wall.
The database has 700 or so points and covers at least part of 4 western
states, which is what I heard was bad for XC Soar terrain generator.
Jim

My B350 database contains:

- the complete BGA turnpoint list (1196 turnpoints, 69 KB)

- the whole of the UK topo and terrain in a .xcm file
(all turnpoints + 25km border at 9 arc-second resolution, 2.5MB)

- the complete UK airspace file (199KB)

on its SD card together with XCSoar 5.2.4mk.

It takes 50 seconds to start up. Apart from the start up time I haven't
seen any performance impact from database size.


--
martin@ | Martin Gregorie
gregorie. | Essex, UK
org |