Question on ditching an Orion

On Oct 28, 9:49*pm, Orval Fairbairn
wrote:
In article ,
*"Dave Kearton" wrote:



"Paul J. Adam" wrote in message
...
In message , Dave Kearton
writes
IMHO Lt Osborn made all the right decisions under very trying
circumstances. He kept the plane aloft, long enough for all the sensitive
gear to be destroyed, he KEPT HIS CREW ALIVE and what was left of the
plane was flown back to the US after the Chinese were done with it.

If you think worst-case, ditching or baling out offers the Chinese a nasty
option. "We picked up nine of the crew, here they are. Mission Supervisor
Snuffy, who knows all about what the aircraft can do and what its mission
was? No, haven't found a trace of him, but we're still searching..." And
who's to know different? Once the crew lose sight of each other, there's
no way to know whether Supervisor Snuffy died during the bailout, drowned
in the ocean, is on a slow fishing boat with no comms on his way to port,
or is being forcibly persuaded to be detailed and explicit about EP-3
capabilities in a Beijing basement.

Once the hard discs, memory cards, crypto modules, whatever have been
dealt with, the EP-3 is an elderly turboprop with a lot of radio receivers
feeding to dead systems. Not a lot of genuine intel value the it's an
ELINT platform, gee whiz, who knew?

The crew are the real prize which could compromise the capability: keeping
them together, alive, and getting them all home protects the most
important asset.

Who cares what the Chinese would see on the plane, they would get that
hardware via other means anyway.

A cynical part of me wonders how much of the hardware is "Made in China"
anyway. Radio receivers aren't exactly new or secret, it's what they feed,
what you can achieve with them and what you were sent to get that matter.

--
He thinks too much, such men are dangerous.

Paul J. Adam

Just parenthetical to all of this, I showed up in Beijing the day after the
incident.

My trip was booked for weeks beforehand, but my engineer and I showed up at
the airport, on 28-day tourist visas with bags full of electronics to work
at the Australian Embassy.

It's a lot more pedestrian than it sounds, but we sailed through customs and
immigration at the airport. * * During our routine briefing, the security
officer at the embassy told us that the Chinese _knew_ we were spooks. (NO -
we weren't, but that didn't matter) * * * *The Chinese didn't care, as long
as they knew what we were up to and what we found out while we were there.
It's only if there is some doubt on this last part that we'd be detained at
the airport - at the end of our 28 days - by the guy with the rubber gloves.

It was a time of slightly elevated tension between the US and China and the
internal security crowd were working overtime on 'visitors' who pretended to
be tourists. * * *We were followed, tailed, politely questioned by locals
and my hotel room was bugged.

Apart from all that, China's a lovely country and we got lots of work
done.....

This reminds me of a story of a married couple of friends who fly for a
major international airline (Both are pilots). He was also an AF Reserve
BG.

We liked to play the board game Risk together, so thy bought an
electronic version to play on layovers. They had a layover in Beijing
and played Risk in the hotel room. I can just hear, "I just captured
Japan" *-- "I just took Great Britain", etc. Of course, the room HAD to
be bugged!

Anyway, they took a guided tour of Beijing the next morning. She
remarked to us that they were the only people on the bus and got a
personal guided tour.

I can just imaging the conversation in Chinese Intel: "What's an
American BG doing in Beijing, masquerading as an airline pilot?"

* * ************

Another friend visited Beijing about 25 years ago, as a member of a
scientific exchange team. At that time, there were two kinds of cars
the green (military) and black (government). They were moved through
Customs and sent to a black car, with Chinese driver, to go to their
quarters and told that the drivers did not speak English. As they were
going down the road, a pig crossed in front of them. Ben,always the
joker, exclaimed, "There goes dinner!" The driver giggled -- they had
another driver the next morning and did not get the original one back.

Had lots of local drivers driving VIPs in Japan that supposedly did
not speak English. All interpreters and drivers were thought to be if
not official Japanese intelligence, reporting to them. Not to mention
the waiters at the clubs. All the hired nationals. Yeah, leaked like a
sieve....