tow rope brake practice crash, what can we learn...

On Jul 12, 8:43*am, Frank Paynter wrote:
On Jul 12, 8:34*am, wrote:


Frank, Hank:

You're both right. The key here is to separate the two things that are
learned by this training 1) practicing the maneuvers you will execute
to recover from a low-altitude rope break or other PTT event 2)
understanding and practicing the psychological part of reacting to any
emergency situation.

Hank's right that #2 is really not well simulated in Condor. But
Frank is right that #1 can be practiced a lot in Condor, and then
executing maneuvers will be much easier in the air.

The same approach is useful, I think, for flight training. At our
club, most of our instructors no longer do a lot of unannounced 200
foot rope breaks. This mixes #1 and #2, creating a "real" emergency.

Instead, we brief, demonstrate and have students practice 200 foot
rope breaks, so they are comfortable with the maneuver required.
Believe me, the first 4-5 times, "you're going to do a 200 foot rope
break on this flight" keeps the adrenaline level up high enough!

We also give them lots of practice with unplanned emergencies, but
all at reasonable altitude. 500' rope breaks, engine failures,
spoilers coming out; "ok the spoiliers are stuck out/closed, now land
it", pretending half the runway is suddenly unusable, and so on are
all great exercises.

If you've got the mechanical skills to do a planned 200 foot break
flawlessly, and the emergency-handling skills to do all the higher-
altitude emergencies with aplomb, you're fairly prepared. We can
discuss whether practicing an actual combination, an unplanned 200'
rope break, is a useful final sanding, or an invitation to practice
stall/spin recovery from 200 feet. But at least we should get to that
point by practicing the mechanical skill and the emergency-handling
skill separately.

John Cochrane

I agree that this sort of maneuver should be first done in a simulator
(where doing it correctly is not the ONLY option) and then done in
real life. I know I would not want to "bet my life" on the student
doing it correctly the first time (while under pressure), especially
from only 200'.

BTW, at the risk of starting a religious war, rope breaks, spins, and
other dangerous maneuvers can be simulated realistically, at any
altitude and weather configuration in Condor.
Bullsh**.

We had an inexperienced guy in a tail heavy Phoebus get into PIO's on
tow. The first one was not too bad. The second one had him climbing at
45 degrees. On the third he went over the top. Certainly no higher
than 300'. The tow rope broke, saving the tow pilot's life. Those of
us watching thought we were looking at a dead man. He pulled back on
the stick and while headed straight down he rolled 180 degrees and
pulled out 10 feet above the runway, landing down wind. Later I asked
him how he pulled that off. His answer: "I've flown a lot of
aerobatics in Microsoft Flight Simulator". !!!

Brian Bange

Except in very strong wind conditions a rope break at or above 200' is
hardly an "emergency". It is a circumstance that requires immediate
action, but appropriate training should make this a routine maneuver,
executed with confidence. A real 150’ rope break becomes a true
emergency at many airports where the glider is going to land off-
airport and the outcome is not certain. The level of training needs to
overcome the “surprise” factor to minimize the delay in reaction
should a rope break take place.

Bob