Learn from a master.

Uh, yeah, that's the ticket. I had to think about this since
I've never really paid much attention to it, but on reflection
I'm one of those that keep their head fairly vertical. There's
a limit to how far over your head can tilt though.

Anyway, I agree with "whatever works" so that you can keep up
your scan. It's my biggest bugaboo with students nowadays
that they never scan for traffic, having spent so much time
in front of video games and flight simulators.

Matt

Originally Posted by Roberto Waltman[_2_]

http://www.whoi.edu/cms/images/ocean...ss2_132253.jpg
--
Roberto Waltman

[ Please reply to the group,
return address is invalid ]

May be interesting to know what foil section is being used for max performance, like in the photo... I know it's variable....

All the bird pictures I have seen have the birds keeping their heads level in steep turns. But few if any do rolls past vertical, AFAIK.

In the UK, I was taught to keep head in line with spine. AFAIK, it is universal here.

It is interesting to watch the techniques of these aerobatic pilots:

http://www.flixxy.com/aerobatic-flight.htm

Chris N

I've seen crows and ravens perform aileron rolls and snap rolls (three in a
row, once!). I never thought to watch their heads during the maneuvers.


"Chris Nicholas" wrote in message
...
All the bird pictures I have seen have the birds keeping their heads level
in steep turns. But few if any do rolls past vertical, AFAIK.

In the UK, I was taught to keep head in line with spine. AFAIK, it is
universal here.

It is interesting to watch the techniques of these aerobatic pilots:

http://www.flixxy.com/aerobatic-flight.htm

Chris N

On Monday, March 4, 2013 7:59:55 PM UTC-7, Chris Nicholas wrote:
All the bird pictures I have seen have the birds keeping their heads level in steep turns. But few if any do rolls past vertical, AFAIK.



In the UK, I was taught to keep head in line with spine. AFAIK, it is universal here.



It is interesting to watch the techniques of these aerobatic pilots:



http://www.flixxy.com/aerobatic-flight.htm



Chris N

While I agree with BobW that it's OK for an individual pilot to use whatever technique 'works' for them, I teach students head in line with spine for several reasons. One is it's less tiring on long flights since the lateral neck muscles aren't as stressed by G forces. Two, a student's vestibular reactions can get confused by constantly leaning the head left and right which also leads to fatigue if not outright air sickness. Third, sitting with the body and head straight establishes a close correlation between butt, head and yaw string which is very useful for "feeling" slips and skids without looking at the yaw string. In effect, it's like using one's body as a highly sensitive ball in a ball/bank instrument.

Birds and humans usually fly for different purposes which leads to different techniques. Their flying is optimized for foraging and species survival. For example, it may be easier to spot a fish if the eyes are level with the water. Our flying is for sport.

The two aerobatic pilots are indeed interesting. The woman is likely predominately using her "feel" of the airplane while the man is predominately using his eyes to accurately position the airplane. Both are valid and necessary for a good pilot.

On 3/5/2013 9:07 AM, Bill D wrote:


While I agree with BobW that it's OK for an individual pilot to use
whatever technique 'works' for them, I teach students head in line
with spine for several reasons. One is it's less tiring on long
flights since the lateral neck muscles aren't as stressed by G
forces. Two, a student's vestibular reactions can get confused by
constantly leaning the head left and right which also leads to
fatigue if not outright air sickness. Third, sitting with the body
and head straight establishes a close correlation between butt, head
and yaw string which is very useful for "feeling" slips and skids
without looking at the yaw string. In effect, it's like using one's
body as a highly sensitive ball in a ball/bank instrument.

If your head is in line with your spine in a turn, how do you
comfortably look in the direction you are turning? I'm normally looking
at right angles to the fuselage at the horizon, so I have to tilt my
head to the right (relative to my body) in a left turn. If I kept it in
line with my spine, I'd have to force my eyeballs way up in my eye
sockets (uncomfortable), and likely the hat brim would keep me from
seeing across the circle.

Maybe we need to take pictures of ourselves in turning flight.

--
Eric Greenwell - Washington State, USA (change ".netto" to ".us" to
email me)
- "Transponders in Sailplanes - Feb/2010" also ADS-B, PCAS, Flarm
http://tinyurl.com/yb3xywl
- "A Guide to Self-launching Sailplane Operation Mar/2004" Much of what
you need to know tinyurl.com/yfs7tnz

If your head is in line with your spine in a turn, how do you
comfortably look in the direction you are turning?

Good question. Shave your eyebrows? I just tried it from an armchair and it doesn't seem difficult either way.

On Tuesday, March 5, 2013 2:12:33 PM UTC-7, Bill D wrote:
If your head is in line with your spine in a turn, how do you

comfortably look in the direction you are turning?

If you can keep your head level with the horizon while thermalling, you are thermalling WAY to shallow! I flew yesterday and tried it - at my normal 40-45 degree of bank there is no way to keep my head level and inside the cockpit, and it would be extremely uncomfortable. Add the fact that I'm looking around, usually into the turn, and the answer is you move your head to the best postition that allows your eyes to see where you want to see.

When doing acro, you have to start with your head aligned to the aircraft axis. Then you move it as needed to pick up your pitch and roll cues.

This should be completely automatic!

Kirk
66

On 3/6/2013 6:57 AM, kirk.stant wrote:
On Tuesday, March 5, 2013 2:12:33 PM UTC-7, Bill D wrote:
If your head is in line with your spine in a turn, how do you

comfortably look in the direction you are turning?

If you can keep your head level with the horizon while thermalling,
you are thermalling WAY to shallow! I flew yesterday and tried it -
at my normal 40-45 degree of bank there is no way to keep my head
level and inside the cockpit, and it would be extremely
uncomfortable. Add the fact that I'm looking around, usually into
the turn, and the answer is you move your head to the best postition
that allows your eyes to see where you want to see.

I routinely thermal at 40-45 degrees, as measured by the instrument
screws. I know I'm not keeping my head in line with my spine, but I
can't be certain it's vertical, either. Maybe it's in between - I'll
take a picture or two next time I fly to see what's happening.

--
Eric Greenwell - Washington State, USA (change ".netto" to ".us" to
email me)

Let us all remember that an albatross, though a great soaring bird,
has an engine.

I've got to believe that somewhere along the 3km flight mentioned
above that he flapped his wings. My $0.02.

No landouts for him!

- John