USAF(?) unit patch ID

"Allen Thomson" wrote in message
om...
Ed Rasimus wrote:

"George Z. Bush" wrote:

Just as a WAG, I think it's probably safe to say that whatever
its origins, they are more than likely NOT American.

I thought that initially as well,

BTW, just out of curiosity, honest question, what is there
about the patch that calls into doubt its American provenance?

Let's turn the thing around. What is there about the patch that establishes its
American provenance? Whatever the language in use is, it doesn't even appear to
be English! Under those circumstances, why not doubt its origins?

Of course, I could be wrong, but that's what does it for me.

George Z.

(I have no idea where the thing came from, but can't see
anything that looks particularly non-USian.)

George Z. Bush wrote:
"Allen Thomson" wrote in message
om...

Ed Rasimus wrote:


"George Z. Bush" wrote:

Just as a WAG, I think it's probably safe to say that whatever
its origins, they are more than likely NOT American.

I thought that initially as well,

BTW, just out of curiosity, honest question, what is there
about the patch that calls into doubt its American provenance?


Let's turn the thing around. What is there about the patch that establishes its
American provenance?

The map is centred on North/Central america so it's not likely to be
European, African or Asian. There also looks to be a star on the map
which my (albeit limited) geography would place in the US.

Whatever the language in use is, it doesn't even appear to
be English!

You'd be betting on Latin America then ?

"George Z. Bush" wrote:

"Allen Thomson" wrote:

BTW, just out of curiosity, honest question, what is there
about the patch that calls into doubt its American provenance?

Let's turn the thing around. What is there about the patch that
establishes its American provenance? Whatever the language in use
is, it doesn't even appear to be English! Under those
circumstances, why not doubt its origins?

I've never been in a USAF wing with an emblem that didn't
display the wing motto in Latin. I've seen one or two
historical unit patches that had the motto in French
- but these units likely had originated there in WW I.
....NEVER in English.

Of course, I could be wrong, but that's what does it for me.

George Z.

(I have no idea where the thing came from, but can't see
anything that looks particularly non-USian.)

"Dweezil Dwarftosser" wrote in message
...
I've never been in a USAF wing with an emblem that didn't
display the wing motto in Latin. I've seen one or two
historical unit patches that had the motto in French
- but these units likely had originated there in WW I.
...NEVER in English.

Perhaps you haven't been in one but they exist. I've been in two at least,
44SMW motto was "Aggressor Beware" and I was in the 355th in the random
sampling below.

http://www.au.af.mil/au/afhra/wwwroo...ges/0355wg.php

http://www.au.af.mil/au/afhra/wwwroo...ges/0004wg.php

http://www.au.af.mil/au/afhra/wwwroo...es/0036abw.php

http://www.au.af.mil/au/afhra/wwwroo...ges/0045sw.php

http://www.au.af.mil/au/afhra/wwwroo...ges/0052fw.php

http://www.au.af.mil/au/afhra/wwwroo...ges/0051fw.php

http://www.au.af.mil/au/afhra/wwwroo...ges/0056fw.php

Regards,

Tex Houston

Dweezil Dwarftosser wrote:


I've never been in a USAF wing with an emblem that didn't
display the wing motto in Latin. I've seen one or two
historical unit patches that had the motto in French
- but these units likely had originated there in WW I.
....NEVER in English.

Well, I wish I could say the same, but the 355th Wing
at DM has their motto in English-- "Our Might Always,"
which might actually sound decent in Latin, but is
absolutely awful sitting there in English on the
patch...

Mike

I've seen one or two
historical unit patches that had the motto in French
- but these units likely had originated there in WW I.
...NEVER in English.

Even units whose history began in France may display their motto in Latin. The
2nd Bomb Wings origins begin in France, yet both its patches had the motto in
Latin. Morto et Destructo - a very cool yet un-PC Death and Destruction and
Liberatus Defensmus (not sure about spelling there) - Defenders of
Liberty(boring!).


BUFDRVR

"Stay on the bomb run boys, I'm gonna get those bomb doors open if it harelips
everyone on Bear Creek"

From: (BUFDRVR)
Date: 4/13/2004 6:18 PM Central Daylight Time
Message-id:

I've seen one or two
historical unit patches that had the motto in French
- but these units likely had originated there in WW I.
...NEVER in English.

Even units whose history began in France may display their motto in Latin.
The
2nd Bomb Wings origins begin in France, yet both its patches had the motto in
Latin. Morto et Destructo - a very cool yet un-PC Death and Destruction and
Liberatus Defensmus (not sure about spelling there) - Defenders of
Liberty(boring!).


BUFDRVR


Hey, it's right up there with 'Defensor Pacis" (defenders of peace) on the 4500
ABW T-39s at Langley AFB in the 1970s.

Dan, U.S. Air Force, retired

Hey, it's right up there with 'Defensor Pacis" (defenders of peace) on the
4500
ABW T-39s at Langley AFB in the 1970s.

The first USAF squadron I was in was the 740th Strategic Missile Squadron of
the 91st Strategic Missile Wing. The squadrons motto was "Custodius Pacis"
;custodians of peace, but if you look in the dictionary you'll also note for
custodian the definition most associated with the word; janitor. We used to
call ourselves the peace janitors.


BUFDRVR

"Stay on the bomb run boys, I'm gonna get those bomb doors open if it harelips
everyone on Bear Creek"

On 14 Apr 2004 12:02:19 GMT, (BUFDRVR) wrote:

Hey, it's right up there with 'Defensor Pacis" (defenders of peace) on the
4500
ABW T-39s at Langley AFB in the 1970s.

The first USAF squadron I was in was the 740th Strategic Missile Squadron of
the 91st Strategic Missile Wing. The squadrons motto was "Custodius Pacis"
;custodians of peace, but if you look in the dictionary you'll also note for
custodian the definition most associated with the word; janitor. We used to
call ourselves the peace janitors.


BUFDRVR

"Stay on the bomb run boys, I'm gonna get those bomb doors open if it harelips
everyone on Bear Creek"

Don't know that I ever, in 23 years, served in a unit with a foreign
language motto on the patch. Most simply had the unit number or the
MAJCOM name---lemme see:

3526 Pilot Training Sqdn--no motto
Muletrain
Hacker (no mottos on flight patches)
4526 Combat Crew Training Sqdn--no motto
388th TFW (oops---Libertas Vel Mors)
421st TFS---"Ready, Willing, Able"
3526 Pilot Training Squadron--no motto
3525 Student Training Squadron (Academics)--"Who Dat?"
311 Combat Crew Training Squadron--no motto
388th TFW (still in Latin--Libertas Vel Mors)
469th TFS ---"World's Finest"
34th TFS ---no motto
401st TFS --- no motto
613 TFS --- no motto
USAFE -- no motto
479th TTW --- (oops ---Protectores Libertatis)
435 TFTS --- no motto
602 TACW --- no motto

For a wealth of patches take a look at
http://www.usafpatches.com/gallery.shtml

Easy organization by unit size (sqdn, group, wing) and numbers.


Ed Rasimus
Fighter Pilot (USAF-Ret)
"When Thunder Rolled"
Smithsonian Institution Press
ISBN #1-58834-103-8

"Ed Rasimus" wrote in message
...
Don't know that I ever, in 23 years, served in a unit with a foreign
language motto on the patch. Most simply had the unit number or the
MAJCOM name---lemme see:

3526 Pilot Training Sqdn--no motto
Muletrain
Hacker (no mottos on flight patches)
4526 Combat Crew Training Sqdn--no motto
388th TFW (oops---Libertas Vel Mors)
421st TFS---"Ready, Willing, Able"
3526 Pilot Training Squadron--no motto
3525 Student Training Squadron (Academics)--"Who Dat?"
311 Combat Crew Training Squadron--no motto
388th TFW (still in Latin--Libertas Vel Mors)
469th TFS ---"World's Finest"
34th TFS ---no motto
401st TFS --- no motto
613 TFS --- no motto
USAFE -- no motto
479th TTW --- (oops ---Protectores Libertatis)
435 TFTS --- no motto
602 TACW --- no motto

Ed Rasimus


Ed,

Squadron patches seldom contain the foreign language mottos, nor do NAFs or
Commands. Seems to be a wing style but as I told John the other day when he
said he had never seen one without the foreign language quite a few contain
English currently.

Examples of Latin...(except 5th)

!st Fighter Wing
2nd Bomb Wing
3rd Wing
5th Bomb Wing
7th Wing
8th Fighter Wing

Six of the first seven I checked. A fairly complete list can be found at...

http://www.maxwell.af.mil/au/afhra/w...oups_index.php

Regards,

Tex