Open Discussion; Creating XC pilots

On Monday, July 21, 2014 9:27:46 AM UTC-7, Bill D wrote:
Instructors can have a lot to do with a new pilot developing a fear of XC in that even if they aren't overtly hostile to XC, they convey their own fears of XC in many subtle ways such as tone of voice, body language, or just the way a training syllabus is presented. Primacy embeds this fear in students

We've seen this with some of our local instructors.

Another issue that I think is subtly at-play: in the Club environment where instruction is already slow, students may naturally make the assumption that XC training - being an "advanced" topic - is going to be even slower than primary training was.

Noel, that's an interesting observation, and one I've never heard before. My club does lose people to the long training process, and that might indeed bias others to not try XC. We'll have to start pointing out that if they've earned a ticket they're 90% of the way towards becoming XC pilots. Thanks!

-John, Q3

On Monday, July 21, 2014 9:49:49 PM UTC-4, noel.wade wrote:
Another issue that I think is subtly at-play: in the Club environment where instruction is already slow, students may naturally make the assumption that XC training - being an "advanced" topic - is going to be even slower than primary training was.

In the UK:
I would say for me lack of XC is due to:

Lack of any possibility for a retrieve crew and no, the fact that I have
recovered others from a field has no relevance whatsoever when trying to
find anyone to retrieve me....It's understandable - people really do have
other things to do in the evening rather than be called out to rescue
someone from a field....particularly if going to be a mega-difficult one
with added aggro' and difficult access, not to mention sitting in the
traffic jams just to get there.

Lack of suitable fields to land in - many either too small or with standing
crop at certain times of the year. Makes you very nervous when looking
down. Some apparently OK fields can be very high risk with the possibility
of overhead wires on the approach or even worse almost invisible barbed
wire fences in the middle of the field.

Abuse and aggro' when landing in a field. The worst was one where the farm
manager was livid and almost foaming at the mouth. Then guess what -
another glider landed in the field seeing that mine had landed
safely...sort of.
The police ended up being called. I could really do without this sort of
thing while ?enjoying? a hobby.

Complex airspace as to where you can and can't go and at what altitude.
Pages of notams to be poured over for all the special last minute
modifications. (The good weather will always be inside restricted
airspace!)

Then there is the fact I always get lost, I'm ever scanning the skies for
the crazed RAF fast jet about to cut me in two....and who cannot possibly
see me

It is simply not worth the aggro.

One word: ADVENTURE!

Dan Marotta

On 7/24/2014 3:03 PM, John Howell wrote:
In the UK:
I would say for me lack of XC is due to:

Lack of any possibility for a retrieve crew and no, the fact that I have
recovered others from a field has no relevance whatsoever when trying to
find anyone to retrieve me....It's understandable - people really do have
other things to do in the evening rather than be called out to rescue
someone from a field....particularly if going to be a mega-difficult one
with added aggro' and difficult access, not to mention sitting in the
traffic jams just to get there.

Lack of suitable fields to land in - many either too small or with standing
crop at certain times of the year. Makes you very nervous when looking
down. Some apparently OK fields can be very high risk with the possibility
of overhead wires on the approach or even worse almost invisible barbed
wire fences in the middle of the field.

Abuse and aggro' when landing in a field. The worst was one where the farm
manager was livid and almost foaming at the mouth. Then guess what -
another glider landed in the field seeing that mine had landed
safely...sort of.
The police ended up being called. I could really do without this sort of
thing while ?enjoying? a hobby.

Complex airspace as to where you can and can't go and at what altitude.
Pages of notams to be poured over for all the special last minute
modifications. (The good weather will always be inside restricted
airspace!)

Then there is the fact I always get lost, I'm ever scanning the skies for
the crazed RAF fast jet about to cut me in two....and who cannot possibly
see me

It is simply not worth the aggro.

Try tiddly winks

Nearly all the problems you mention are mitigated by practice and planning.
Top xc pilots do 000's of k without landing in farmer's fields outside of
competition every year.

Even in comps they tend to land on airfields, especially in the UK where
there are plenty. Many now have engines and don't land out at all!

Practice and planning, or tiddly winks.



At 21:03 24 July 2014, John Howell wrote:

In the UK:
I would say for me lack of XC is due to:

Lack of any possibility for a retrieve crew and no, the fact that I have
recovered others from a field has no relevance whatsoever when trying to
find anyone to retrieve me....It's understandable - people really do have
other things to do in the evening rather than be called out to rescue
someone from a field....particularly if going to be a mega-difficult one
with added aggro' and difficult access, not to mention sitting in the
traffic jams just to get there.

Lack of suitable fields to land in - many either too small or with
standing
crop at certain times of the year. Makes you very nervous when looking
down. Some apparently OK fields can be very high risk with the
possibility
of overhead wires on the approach or even worse almost invisible barbed
wire fences in the middle of the field.

Abuse and aggro' when landing in a field. The worst was one where the
farm
manager was livid and almost foaming at the mouth. Then guess what -
another glider landed in the field seeing that mine had landed
safely...sort of.
The police ended up being called. I could really do without this sort of
thing while ?enjoying? a hobby.

Complex airspace as to where you can and can't go and at what altitude.
Pages of notams to be poured over for all the special last minute
modifications. (The good weather will always be inside restricted
airspace!)

Then there is the fact I always get lost, I'm ever scanning the skies for
the crazed RAF fast jet about to cut me in two....and who cannot possibly
see me

It is simply not worth the aggro.

On Friday, July 25, 2014 2:36:39 AM UTC-4, Jim White wrote:
Try tiddly winks

Or perhaps some dual time in a high performance twin with a good XC pilot on (here's the key) a good day. 90% of keeping "recreational XC" recreational is keeping your plans and expectations in line with what mother nature gives you to work with.


Evan Ludeman

On Thu, 24 Jul 2014 21:03:21 +0000, John Howell wrote:

In the UK:
Me also.

I would say for me lack of XC is due to:

Lack of any possibility for a retrieve crew and no, the fact that I have
recovered others from a field has no relevance whatsoever when trying to
find anyone to retrieve me....

We tend to use mutual retrieval agreements.

Lack of suitable fields to land in - many either too small or with
standing crop at certain times of the year.

Fair comment.

Abuse and aggro' when landing in a field.

I've been in a few and flown competition free flight models for longer
than I've been gliding. Never had that reaction, in either case.

Complex airspace as to where you can and can't go and at what altitude.
Pages of notams to be poured over for all the special last minute
modifications.

Use SPINE - its much quicker than scanning through printed NOTAM lists.
Better yet, if the NOTAM is plottable SPINE can save it in a file your nav
system can display.

Then there is the fact I always get lost,

Both LK8000 and XCSoar are open source, hence free, navigation programs
that run on reasonably priced/inexpensive satnav kit and can display both
NOTAMs saved by SPINE and landout field details. Both are also useful for
local soaring: just set up a task with your home field as the only
turnpoint and, as well as keeping book on whether have the height to get
home, they'll show any restricted airspace/NOTAMs in the area.


--
martin@ | Martin Gregorie
gregorie. | Essex, UK
org |