Notable Power Flarm saves - Is it 'worth it'?

Size matters,
Godzilla

On Saturday, April 28, 2018 at 9:22:30 PM UTC-7, jfitch wrote:
Actually my tiny 5.7" iPhone screen does all of that too. I think those who only have the old (or new) Flarm screen are missing a lot of the value. If those targets are always on your tactical screen, you already know where to look for them before the Bitchin' Betty starts to bark.

As Jon points out the situational awareness provided by Flarm helps keep pilots informed of threats before it araises to a save. If you don’t already have it GET FLARM, it is worth it.

Power Flarm works and it works good.
A couple of years ago flying just SW of Parowan heading SW I got a ADS-B warning. It was the Beech 1900 airliner headed into Cedar City. I visually saw it over my right shoulder and keep on my heading. After a couple of minutes it was clear that we would pass very close. I changed my heading and got out of the way.
Last summer flying out of Crawford Colorado I got another ADS-B warning, it was a business jet flying right at me going into land at Montrose Colorado.. This was very close also.
Flarm is remarkable and is not that expensive or hard to install; if you don't have one get one, with the extra antenna and IGC logger connected to a large screen like a Oudie, it is awesome. And it is available NOW.

Incidentally, both LX Nav and LX Navigation
(is that the Peoples Front Of Judea and the Judean Peoples Front?)
have new devices that will add PowerFLARM to your existing moving map display. About $900 US.
Jim

On Monday, April 30, 2018 at 7:34:53 PM UTC-7, JS wrote:
Incidentally, both LX Nav and LX Navigation
(is that the Peoples Front Of Judea and the Judean Peoples Front?)
have new devices that will add PowerFLARM to your existing moving map display. About $900 US.
Jim

Sorry to disappoint but (when FCC approval is obtained) LXNAV PowerMouse USA with ADS-b, IGC, Second Antenna closer to $1700 USD.

$900 for Flarm only and not certified in the USA.

Richard
www.craggyaero.com

On Saturday, April 28, 2018 at 7:59:26 AM UTC-7, son_of_flubber wrote:
When I installed Power Flarm (PF) in 2013, I had no idea whether it would ever 'save my butt'. Not many people have it in my area.......


Regarding Flarms and Transponders, I find it odd that my glider insurance isn't reduced when one of these is installed. I assume the insurance companies believe neither produces a significant reduction in accidents. However the worry of collisions, however remote, induced me to install something.

The hassle/cost/space/power/antenna considerations of fitting either system caused me to consider which (Transponder or Flarm) would be the best choice. My decision was to get a Trig 22 and not a Flarm. I also easily generated SIL=0 ADSB-out using one of my two existing onboard (uncertified) GPSs (I am experimental). I could move to SIL=3, but right now see not much added protection, and feel the price of a certified gps is a gouge.

My reasoning was that a transponder gave me better protection than Flarm from commercial power traffic, which seems the most catastrophic risk. I will be visible 'for free' to gliders with Flarm, which will see my transponder, and maybe my SIL=0 ADSB-out too.

I'm now looking for a low-cost ADSB receiver and traffic display, to be able to see all transponder traffic myself. Regrettably, I don't believe that will enable me to see Flarm-only traffic, but they will continue to be able to see my transponder.

Would anyone disagree that a Transponder is now a better choice than Flarm in the USA?

You know...I get it. Flarms are very cool and glider specific.
BUT, transponders are the primary anti-collision tool for all aircraft.
I strongly argue that a transponder should be the first collision avoidance instrument installed in a glider.
Flying in the busy airspace around Reno with transponder on and transponder off and observing/listening to traffic control and the many "heavies" flying in the area made it so clear how powerful they are.
Then there is the problem that many don't want to discuss and that is the blind spots that Flarms have in carbon fiber gliders. There needs to be some serious work on external antennas for carbon fiber gliders.

On Tuesday, May 1, 2018 at 7:06:47 AM UTC-7, wrote:
You know...I get it. Flarms are very cool and glider specific.
BUT, transponders are the primary anti-collision tool for all aircraft.
I strongly argue that a transponder should be the first collision avoidance instrument installed in a glider.
Flying in the busy airspace around Reno with transponder on and transponder off and observing/listening to traffic control and the many "heavies" flying in the area made it so clear how powerful they are.
Then there is the problem that many don't want to discuss and that is the blind spots that Flarms have in carbon fiber gliders. There needs to be some serious work on external antennas for carbon fiber gliders.

I agree about the external flarm antenna. I have always thought it would be simple to make one that is as thin and flexible as a piece of tape, and the coax could be fed through an 1/8" hole in the bottom of the cockpit. Yes, polarization is wrong, but way better than seeing nothing below you. of course a vertical antenna on both side of the cockpit would be perfect. Any RF engineers out there care to comment?

Matt

Maybe I'm missing something but, the way I see it, one of the key differences between Flarm and a transponder is with the Flarm, you get information about other aircraft in your cockpit.

With a transponder, you get no information in your cockpit and are relying only on visual contact to see and avoid. You are relying on the other aircraft (possibly with ATCs help) to avoid you.

I've been flying with Flarm for 3 years and am adding a transponder now. I've determined the best answer is both.

Total cost = about $5K. I think that's a good investment in increased safety.

Lou

Sounds to me like you're on the right track!

I've had a Trig 22 for 6-7 years and, since installing it, have not seen
any GA or airline traffic "up close".Â* I added a PF portable when one
became available locally at a great price and I've been happy with its
performance, especially with seeing the ADS-B traffic on the Flarm which
is displayed on my ClearNav and on my wife's Streak/XCSoar in the right
seat.Â* I don't see much glider traffic on the Flarm except around the
airport since I tend to fly alone or with just one gliding buddy.

For a cheap ADS-B In solution in an experimental ship, look at Stratux.Â*
You can pick up a ready to install system for around $250
https://www.amazon.com/Stratux-Receiver-Aviation-Weather-Traffic/dp/B071HMQY19/ref=sr_1_1_sspa?ie=UTF8&qid=1525184065&sr=8-1-spons&keywords=stratux&psc=1
or build it yourself with parts from Amazon for under $100.Â* It's all
open source software and there's a parts list
http://stratux.me/#parts-list on stratux.me.

I bought a home-assembled unit from another poster on this newsgroup for
$75, played with it for a few months (it works really well!), and then
sold it on to another user for what I paid for it.Â* Mine was made up of
basic parts and there were a lot of cables strung around the cockpit
which I didn't like, though the performance was great.Â* A ready made
unit with everything in a purpose built box is the way to go.

Good luck!

On 5/1/2018 7:01 AM, wrote:
On Saturday, April 28, 2018 at 7:59:26 AM UTC-7, son_of_flubber wrote:
When I installed Power Flarm (PF) in 2013, I had no idea whether it would ever 'save my butt'. Not many people have it in my area.......

Regarding Flarms and Transponders, I find it odd that my glider insurance isn't reduced when one of these is installed. I assume the insurance companies believe neither produces a significant reduction in accidents. However the worry of collisions, however remote, induced me to install something.

The hassle/cost/space/power/antenna considerations of fitting either system caused me to consider which (Transponder or Flarm) would be the best choice. My decision was to get a Trig 22 and not a Flarm. I also easily generated SIL=0 ADSB-out using one of my two existing onboard (uncertified) GPSs (I am experimental). I could move to SIL=3, but right now see not much added protection, and feel the price of a certified gps is a gouge.

My reasoning was that a transponder gave me better protection than Flarm from commercial power traffic, which seems the most catastrophic risk. I will be visible 'for free' to gliders with Flarm, which will see my transponder, and maybe my SIL=0 ADSB-out too.

I'm now looking for a low-cost ADSB receiver and traffic display, to be able to see all transponder traffic myself. Regrettably, I don't believe that will enable me to see Flarm-only traffic, but they will continue to be able to see my transponder.

Would anyone disagree that a Transponder is now a better choice than Flarm in the USA?


--
Dan, 5J