Silly controller

Doug wrote:
I was once told, just outside the FAF "the approach is APPROVED, radar
services TERMINATED". And yes kiddies I was in a cloud. (He musta been
a supervisor :-)


Not sure what he meant by approved, but radar services terminated means
he's not providing radar services to you when you're below
MVA,regardless of whether you're IFR or VFR.

Doug wrote:
I was once told, just outside the FAF "the approach is APPROVED, radar
services TERMINATED". And yes kiddies I was in a cloud. (He musta been
a supervisor :-)


Not sure what he meant by approved, but radar services terminated means
he's not providing radar services to you when you're below
MVA,regardless of whether you're IFR or VFR.

"Brad" wrote in message
oups.com...

Not sure what he meant by approved, but radar services terminated means
he's not providing radar services to you when you're below
MVA,regardless of whether you're IFR or VFR.


Radar Service Terminated means the pilot will no longer be provided any of
the services that could be received while in radar contact. MVA has nothing
to do with it.

Radar services terminated is not the same thing as IFR being cancelled.
Where I fly I'm always told that "Radar services terminated, contact
xx tower on 120.9" I'm still fully IFR, and may or may not be in the
clouds and although he says he's terminated radar services he is more
than likely still keeping an eye on me. If I were to veer way off
course he'd call my tower and ask what the heck n12345 was doing.

Robert

Doug wrote:
I was once told, just outside the FAF "the approach is APPROVED, radar
services TERMINATED". And yes kiddies I was in a cloud. (He musta been
a supervisor :-)

Brad wrote:

Robert M. Gary wrote:

The other day I was doing a VFR practice approach into Tracy, CA when
the controller told me "reporting canceling IFR this freq, or on ground
via land line...". I told him "uh, ok canceling IFR, I didn't believe I
was IFR" (because I hadn't asked for or received an IFR clearance).
The controller told me that any aircraft on an approach clearance is
IFR for the purposes of the approach. I guess even controllers can be
students?

-Robert

At least it's better than the controller who told my instrument student
as we approached the FAF, (we were on an IFR flight plan) "IFR
canceled, squawk VFR, frequency change approved." even though we hadn't
canceled. It was VMC, so operationally it wasn't a big deal for us,
but I learned from TRACON's QC person that the controller was a trainee
and the instructing controller missed it.

"Robert Chambers" wrote in message
. ..

Radar services terminated is not the same thing as IFR being cancelled.
Where I fly I'm always told that "Radar services terminated, contact xx
tower on 120.9" I'm still fully IFR, and may or may not be in the clouds
and although he says he's terminated radar services he is more than likely
still keeping an eye on me. If I were to veer way off course he'd call my
tower and ask what the heck n12345 was doing.


Note that the word APPROVED was emphasized. I think the point being made
was that the controller thought he was VFR and thus approved the approach
instead of clearing him for it as he should have done.

"Denny" wrote in message
oups.com...
Umm, I would like to see this cancellation scenario happen when the IFR
student is on his check ride with either an FAA examiner or DER in the
plane... Watching two branches of the federal government duke it out
could be highly entertaining...

Which two of the three (Judicial, Legislative, Executive)?

Are you one of those modern public school graduates? :~)

"Steven P. McNicoll" writes:

"Christopher C. Stacy" wrote in message
...

When he gave you the clearance for the approach, did he say
"Maintain VFR?" If not, you were really IFR.


No. You're really IFR when you hear "Cleared to..."

Like in, "Cleared for the ILS runway 23 at Foobar maintain 2000 until established" ?

The controller said
"Reporting canceling IFR this freq or..."

-Robert


Robert Chambers wrote:
Radar services terminated is not the same thing as IFR being cancelled.
Where I fly I'm always told that "Radar services terminated, contact
xx tower on 120.9" I'm still fully IFR, and may or may not be in the
clouds and although he says he's terminated radar services he is more
than likely still keeping an eye on me. If I were to veer way off
course he'd call my tower and ask what the heck n12345 was doing.

Robert

Doug wrote:
I was once told, just outside the FAF "the approach is APPROVED, radar
services TERMINATED". And yes kiddies I was in a cloud. (He musta been
a supervisor :-)

Brad wrote:

Robert M. Gary wrote:

The other day I was doing a VFR practice approach into Tracy, CA when
the controller told me "reporting canceling IFR this freq, or on ground
via land line...". I told him "uh, ok canceling IFR, I didn't believe I
was IFR" (because I hadn't asked for or received an IFR clearance).
The controller told me that any aircraft on an approach clearance is
IFR for the purposes of the approach. I guess even controllers can be
students?

-Robert

At least it's better than the controller who told my instrument student
as we approached the FAF, (we were on an IFR flight plan) "IFR
canceled, squawk VFR, frequency change approved." even though we hadn't
canceled. It was VMC, so operationally it wasn't a big deal for us,
but I learned from TRACON's QC person that the controller was a trainee
and the instructing controller missed it.

Christopher C. Stacy wrote:
"Steven P. McNicoll" writes:

"Christopher C. Stacy" wrote in message
...

When he gave you the clearance for the approach, did he say
"Maintain VFR?" If not, you were really IFR.


No. You're really IFR when you hear "Cleared to..."

Like in, "Cleared for the ILS runway 23 at Foobar maintain 2000 until established" ?
Or "Cleared to Land"

Word games aside, Steven is right. The difference between being IFR and
VFR in controlled airspace is being told "cleared to foobar".

-Robert

"Christopher C. Stacy" wrote in message
...

Like in, "Cleared for the ILS runway 23 at Foobar maintain 2000 until
established" ?


No. Like when you picked up your IFR clearance some time prior to that and
heard "Cleared to..."