C172 and Spins

On Mar 17, 5:42*pm, wrote:
On Mar 17, 3:19 pm, Dan wrote:

Anyone else have expereince with the C172E (1964)?

No matter what I did I could not get that bird to spin to the right.

Left spins take some work, and power helps (of course).

But right it just wallows and then steep spirals.

Dan Mc

* * 172s are reluctant to spin anyway. They'll do it to the lft
readily enough if some power is used to get the speed lower and nose
higher just before stall, but to the right they'll sometimes just
rumble around into a spiral. The left wing stalls earlier due to the
rotating propeller blast striking the left root at a higher AOA, and
so trying to spin right just makes them both stall at the same time,
which won't encourage autorotation.

* * * Dan

What is difference between a spin and a spiral?

On Mar 17, 9:42 pm, skym wrote:
On Mar 17, 5:42 pm, wrote:



On Mar 17, 3:19 pm, Dan wrote:

Anyone else have expereince with the C172E (1964)?

No matter what I did I could not get that bird to spin to the right.

Left spins take some work, and power helps (of course).

But right it just wallows and then steep spirals.

Dan Mc

172s are reluctant to spin anyway. They'll do it to the lft
readily enough if some power is used to get the speed lower and nose
higher just before stall, but to the right they'll sometimes just
rumble around into a spiral. The left wing stalls earlier due to the
rotating propeller blast striking the left root at a higher AOA, and
so trying to spin right just makes them both stall at the same time,
which won't encourage autorotation.

Dan

What is difference between a spin and a spiral?

A spin is a condition of stalled flight -- usually due to yaw applied
at the moment the wing stalls. This can be caused intentionally or
unintentionally (such as not accounting for left turning when
practicing stalls).

Airspeed is very low, while descent rate is high, all while pitching
and yawing to the right or left. One wing is providing slightly more
lift and this causes the autorotation.

The wings are not stalled in a spiral, and the airspeed is high and/
or increasing.


Dan Mc

skym wrote:
On Mar 17, 5:42 pm, wrote:
On Mar 17, 3:19 pm, Dan wrote:

Anyone else have expereince with the C172E (1964)?
No matter what I did I could not get that bird to spin to the right.
Left spins take some work, and power helps (of course).
But right it just wallows and then steep spirals.
Dan Mc
172s are reluctant to spin anyway. They'll do it to the lft
readily enough if some power is used to get the speed lower and nose
higher just before stall, but to the right they'll sometimes just
rumble around into a spiral. The left wing stalls earlier due to the
rotating propeller blast striking the left root at a higher AOA, and
so trying to spin right just makes them both stall at the same time,
which won't encourage autorotation.

Dan

What is difference between a spin and a spiral?
The short answer. There are much longer ones :-))
Autorotation.

The spin requires 2 very distinct things to happen aerodynamically;
stall and a yaw rate. A spiral is an ever tightening nose low condition
with constantly increasing airspeed that occurs above stall and involves
no autorotation.
--
Dudley Henriques

Some SEL airplanes are not certified for spins. I assume the 172 isn't
in that group.

On Mar 18, 8:19 am, Tina wrote:
Some SEL airplanes are not certified for spins. I assume the 172 isn't
in that group.

The POH will let you know if spins are permitted in the airplane.

The 172E is approved for spins while loaded in the Utility category
(easily loaded that way with two occupants in the front seats and no
anvil in the baggage area).


Dan Mc

Tina wrote:
Some SEL airplanes are not certified for spins. I assume the 172 isn't
in that group.

I'm pretty sure that all of the older 172s (before production restarted in
'97) are approved for intentional spins in the Utility Category. Not sure
about the later models.

The nice thing about the 172 is that it's pretty easy to get it into the
Utility Category. My Cherokee, on the other hand, requires some careful W&B
to fit into its relatively narrow U.C. envelope. I'd spin it a lot more if
it wasn't such a pain.

John Galban=====N4BQ (PA28-180)

--
Message posted via AviationKB.com
http://www.aviationkb.com/Uwe/Forums...ation/200803/1

On Tue, 18 Mar 2008 05:19:25 -0700 (PDT), Tina
wrote:

Some SEL airplanes are not certified for spins. I assume the 172 isn't
in that group.

The ones I've seen are approved for spins only when loaded into the
utility catagory.

On Mon, 17 Mar 2008 18:38:38 -0400, Dudley Henriques
wrote:

Dan wrote:
Anyone else have expereince with the C172E (1964)?

No matter what I did I could not get that bird to spin to the right.

Left spins take some work, and power helps (of course).

But right it just wallows and then steep spirals.



Dan Mc
Try accelerating the stall a bit just before reaching the 1g stall point .
Decelerate the airplane carrying just a bit of power into the stall,
then just before it would break naturally, apply aggressive pitch, as
the stall breaks, apply full pro-spin rudder. It should break a lot
cleaner and right into the spin; assuming normal rigging.

Of course an extra bit of enthusiasm could lead to a snap roll. :-))
Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member)
(N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair)
www.rogerhalstead.com

Roger wrote:
On Mon, 17 Mar 2008 18:38:38 -0400, Dudley Henriques
wrote:

Dan wrote:
Anyone else have expereince with the C172E (1964)?

No matter what I did I could not get that bird to spin to the right.

Left spins take some work, and power helps (of course).

But right it just wallows and then steep spirals.



Dan Mc
Try accelerating the stall a bit just before reaching the 1g stall point .
Decelerate the airplane carrying just a bit of power into the stall,
then just before it would break naturally, apply aggressive pitch, as
the stall breaks, apply full pro-spin rudder. It should break a lot
cleaner and right into the spin; assuming normal rigging.

Of course an extra bit of enthusiasm could lead to a snap roll. :-))
Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member)
(N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair)
www.rogerhalstead.com


Timing Rog....TIMING!!! With women and flying.......it's all in the
TIMING!!!! :-)))

--
Dudley Henriques

On Mar 18, 8:57 pm, Roger wrote:
On Mon, 17 Mar 2008 18:38:38 -0400, Dudley Henriques



wrote:
Dan wrote:
Anyone else have expereince with the C172E (1964)?

No matter what I did I could not get that bird to spin to the right.

Left spins take some work, and power helps (of course).

But right it just wallows and then steep spirals.

Dan Mc
Try accelerating the stall a bit just before reaching the 1g stall point .
Decelerate the airplane carrying just a bit of power into the stall,
then just before it would break naturally, apply aggressive pitch, as
the stall breaks, apply full pro-spin rudder. It should break a lot
cleaner and right into the spin; assuming normal rigging.

Of course an extra bit of enthusiasm could lead to a snap roll. :-))
Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member)
(N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair)www.rogerhalstead.com

An enthusiastic Cross control stall has the same effect.

"Hey, I'm right side up!"
"Hey, I'm upside down!"

:-)

Dan