i think I flew into class c airspace accidentally withoutestablishing communication

On Jan 26, 11:38*am, wrote:
I'm sorry if I gave anyone the impression that I was not concerned for
the safety of others. *I am familiar with the area we were in, but I
made a serious mistake at night.


It strikes me that you really don't know whether or not you busted
Class C. If I was you I would try to find out for sure. If you
didn't enter Class C, then you are in the clear on this incident.

Phil

On Jan 26, 10:00 am, Phil J wrote:
On Jan 26, 11:38 am, wrote:

I'm sorry if I gave anyone the impression that I was not concerned for
the safety of others. I am familiar with the area we were in, but I
made a serious mistake at night.

It strikes me that you really don't know whether or not you busted
Class C. If I was you I would try to find out for sure. If you
didn't enter Class C, then you are in the clear on this incident.

One thing to check would be whether the GPS you used maintained a
tracklog record of the flight. If so, that tracklog may still be
available and can be compared to the airspace maps of the area to
determine if any violation occurred.

wrote:
I'm sorry if I gave anyone the impression that I was not concerned for
the safety of others. I am familiar with the area we were in, but I
made a serious mistake at night. I do appreciate all the options you
all have laid out for me. I will fill out the NASA form immediately.
And why on Earth would someone put my name in the thread? That just
seems uncalled for.

Because Larry is an idiot as anyone who has followed this ng for more
than 3 months quickly figures out.

Matt

Matt Whiting wrote:
wrote:
I'm sorry if I gave anyone the impression that I was not concerned for
the safety of others. I am familiar with the area we were in, but I
made a serious mistake at night. I do appreciate all the options you
all have laid out for me. I will fill out the NASA form immediately.
And why on Earth would someone put my name in the thread? That just
seems uncalled for.

Because Larry is an idiot as anyone who has followed this ng for more
than 3 months quickly figures out.

Three months? Are you a slow learner???

On Jan 27, 6:38*am, wrote:
I'm sorry if I gave anyone the impression that I was not concerned for
the safety of others. *I am familiar with the area we were in, but I
made a serious mistake at night. *I do appreciate all the options you
all have laid out for me. *I will fill out the NASA form immediately.
And why on Earth would someone put my name in the thread? *That just
seems uncalled for.

I'm not yet a pilot, but it sounds like you were acting as if you were
flying IFR -how else could you be thrown off course by the GPS? I've
not done my night rating work but I've been told that flying VFR at
night requires constant attention to lights, compass heading(s)/
bearings and gloomy shadows to know your position. I think the GPS
should be considered to be only an aid for VFR pilots, not the primary
navigation tool (which is eyes, brain and chart) and if I am right in
my student pilot opinion, the autopilot should be slaved to compass
and position checked by GPS -not dictated by GPS (until you are IFR).
I would welcome more experienced pilots to comment on this -should a
VFR pilot slave the autopilot to GPS or compass?

You started a good thread here and it's great that you admit your
mistake for us to learn from it.

Cheers

WingFlaps wrote:
On Jan 27, 6:38 am, wrote:
I'm sorry if I gave anyone the impression that I was not concerned for
the safety of others. I am familiar with the area we were in, but I
made a serious mistake at night. I do appreciate all the options you
all have laid out for me. I will fill out the NASA form immediately.
And why on Earth would someone put my name in the thread? That just
seems uncalled for.

I'm not yet a pilot, but it sounds like you were acting as if you were
flying IFR -how else could you be thrown off course by the GPS? I've
not done my night rating work but I've been told that flying VFR at
night requires constant attention to lights, compass heading(s)/
bearings and gloomy shadows to know your position. I think the GPS
should be considered to be only an aid for VFR pilots, not the primary
navigation tool (which is eyes, brain and chart) and if I am right in
my student pilot opinion, the autopilot should be slaved to compass
and position checked by GPS -not dictated by GPS (until you are IFR).
I would welcome more experienced pilots to comment on this -should a
VFR pilot slave the autopilot to GPS or compass?

You started a good thread here and it's great that you admit your
mistake for us to learn from it.

Cheers



What if you are VFR over a cloud layer? There are lots of times that
GPS, VOR and even ADF are the primary navigation aids for VFR pilots.

On Sat, 26 Jan 2008 09:38:17 -0800 (PST), wrote
in
:

And why on Earth would someone put my name in the thread?

Actually, you put your name is in the 'From:' field of the message you
originally posted yourself. If you have concerns about revealing your
identity, you should take steps to conceal it.

That just seems uncalled for.

It was intended as a slap in the face to get your attention. It's
clear your CFI wasn't able to impart the significance of becoming an
airman to you. That is an area of flight training the FAA seems to
have virtually overlooked. Becoming an airman is (or should be) a
life-changing experience.

It's evident from your post, that you don't yet clearly appreciate
your role in navigating the skies. You are an airman now. If the
_responsibility_ associated with that hasn't dawned on you yet, it
will as you build experiences like the one you related.

You are Pilot In Command! Those with whom and over whom you fly rely
upon YOUR judgment to keep them safe, and that demands that you comply
with regulations ALL THE TIME. If you fail to do that, you have
failed in your responsibility to yourself, your passenger, and all of
your fellow airmen who share the sky with you.

Flying is not a hobby; it serious business, life-and-death business.
If your assessment of the weather forecast for the flight is an issue,
will you have the courage to stand steadfast in your refusal to fly
your companions home from Las Vegas in time for them to clock-in at
work? Or will you permit their complaints to influence you to do
something you know is wrong? They will push you mercilessly to
depart, but tacitly they expect you to keep them safe. You'll have to
firmly assume command of the situation and do what you know is right.
Give it some thought. Please.

Larry Dighera wrote:

You are Pilot In Command!

And you are a idiot!

On Jan 27, 8:24 am, Larry Dighera wrote:
On Sat, 26 Jan 2008 09:38:17 -0800 (PST), wrote
in
:

And why on Earth would someone put my name in the thread?

Actually, you put your name is in the 'From:' field of the message you
originally posted yourself. If you have concerns about revealing your
identity, you should take steps to conceal it.

There is a huge difference between using an email address with a
partial name, as opposed to printing the entire name in full. Sure, a
pilot or interested person reading this thread could have figured it
out, but the average joe researching the OP wouldn't have found it.
But now you've put the name onto USENET for the search engines to pick
up.

Worst case: An employer, googling the name, will now find this thread.
They probably won't have an aviation background and will not have the
knowledge to evaluate the misake, so they'll probably assume the
worst.

If you felt like you HAD to name him, you could of at least obfuscated
his name slightly. J--N SM--H instead of JOHN SMITH or something.

The OP did something stupid, and realised he made a mistake. He was
man enough to own up to it. Maybe you should do the same.

Al

wrote:
I'm sorry if I gave anyone the impression that I was not concerned for
the safety of others. I am familiar with the area we were in, but I
made a serious mistake at night. I do appreciate all the options you
all have laid out for me. I will fill out the NASA form immediately.
And why on Earth would someone put my name in the thread? That just
seems uncalled for.

It was very tacky for Larry to do that but it is what can be expected
form Larry.

Keep in mind though you did post with enough info that anyone could have
found your full name.