Heavy pilot - what glider to opt for?

My club has a Grob 102 CS-77. The L/D is about 36 or so, retractable gear.
I'm 6'3", 240 lbs and fit nicely in the cockpit, but without a parachute (haven't tried -- think my head would hit the top of the canopy, and I'd be over gross weight). There are some taller pilots in my club that also fly the ship.

Flight characteristics are nice (not great), but a bit under-ruddered; think of it as a sportier version of the G103. I can't spin it, probably because of my weight bringing the CG forward and there isn't much tendency to drop a wing during stall.

I hear the Genesis 2 has a nice large cockpit. I know the Kestrel does (I fly a Kestrel 19)

I used to fly N131SS, the Astir CS which George Vakkur featured his chapter of "Ridge Soaring The Bald Eagle Ridge". Had some great thermal and ridge flights in it.
Very roomy. Easy to fly. Taping the wing roots is a chore. They had a few ADs which should all be taken care of by now. You can't take off with the tail dolly on, and that dolly even stores in the cockpit.
Bob Harris' World Altitude record was in a newer version of the "Baby Grob". Like the one Rick Anderson is selling on W+W now.
Jim

I owned a CS the last 4 years and made about 120 xc flights up to 500km. After some training the assembling is no problem, and flight characteristics are better than its reputation. Water ballast is always good, and the turbulator tape improves handling in thermals.

Max cockpit weight however is reduced in most Astir CS, mine was max. 96kg (211lbs)

I am big ,wide shoulders and hips ', 6ft 1 in shoes and near top limit
weight wise. I have tried a lot of ships and here is my list in order of
size-comfort
ASW17 cockpit large and long ,not a beginner ship
LS3 cockpit large and long ,good beginner ship ,powerful airbrakes can
land heavy
Kestrel 17 and 19 very long, reasonable beginner ship
Ventus B cockpit not as large and long ,touchy controls ,not really a
beginner ship, has an abrupt spin entry,
Asw 20 and 19 deceptive in cockpit arrangement, with a bit of arranging and
setting up can fit a fairly large long pilot
DG all single seaters are snug width wise but very long I think up to 6ft
8 no probs.





At 02:17 11 November 2013, Frank Whiteley wrote:
On Saturday, November 9, 2013 1:58:04 PM UTC-7, Ventus_a wrote:
"Gary O'Neill[_2_ Wrote:=20
=20
;846500"]I am going to suggest a Lak 12 , they are rated to have the
=20
cockpit weight
=20
raised up to 130kgs with tail weights but they are for the long
legged
=20
shorter bodied person, I do not fit!
=20

=20
=20
=20
Would like to know where the 130 kg figure comes from. The flight
=20
manual says 110 kg max cockpit
=20
=20
=20
=20
=20
=20
=20
=20
=20
--=20
=20
Ventus_a

BGA has a faxed letter from the factory allowing 130kg in the cockpit if
3k=
g of lead are installed in the tail. AFAIK, this was for a single
glider,
=
LAK-12 sn 6178. However, there is another letter on the same topic
regardi=
ng BGA 4170, which refers to the same FAX date. I presume it's the same
gl=
ider, however, apart from the date of the FAX, nothing in the
correspondenc=
e links the serial number to the registration. Seems to be a one off
appro=
val.

YMMV

I am an early solo pilot looking to buy my first glider, but don't really know what to go for! I want it for local soaring, but eventually to go cross country in it.



The slight issue is that I am 6`4 tall and 17.5 stone - arguably too heavy, but the question is what to go for.



I'll obviously need a roomy cockpit!



Any thoughts would be appreciated!

I am or was when flying 6'3" and 260 (about 18.5 stone) Flew comfortably all Schweizer products, Pegasus, Nimbus 3 (took seat out and set on the floor with padding), Std. Cirrus, Ventus.

g. kemp

On Wednesday, 30 October 2013 19:17:44 UTC, wrote:
Good evening,



I need some assistance!



I am an early solo pilot looking to buy my first glider, but don't really know what to go for! I want it for local soaring, but eventually to go cross country in it.



The slight issue is that I am 6`4 tall and 17.5 stone - arguably too heavy, but the question is what to go for.



I'll obviously need a roomy cockpit!



Any thoughts would be appreciated!

Here is My 5p worth I am 6 ft 2. A PPL but not renewed my PPL licence and took up Gliding in Oct 2012. I went solo 010113 the problems I had were, my weight and size, being 242lbs naked ... so diet and got down to 230lbs ok I like red wine and approaching 60 years of age ... so hard and still going down reduce portions eat slower don't snack, drink less alcohol. Its a hard decision. work on the assumption everything you put in your mouth is 100 calories except water and tea. So 1700 calories a day Max. Clues, I slice of toast 100 calories one boiled egg 100 calories cup of tea no sugar 4 cals water zero. They are all less than that but 100 cals ! But 100cal a slice works! Trust me ! I'm a Chef.

Second in my view most clubs don't like older pilots, they like 21 year olds not 50 to 60 year olds, lots of reasons why ( but if you are that keen put up with the **** and enjoy the flying, take your time.

Third. Gliders, because I have wide shoulders narrow hips and a paunch .... I don't fit well in a K13 but fine in a K21, now most clubs are NOT happy for you to hog their prize ship ... so that becomes and Issue, If the Club you fly at are more interested in flying red letter days than members, move club. Not all clubs are the same.

First glider .... I think I missed the bit in the club manual where it says don't buy a glider till you have spoken to your CFI .... OOps ! Now thats when the CFI had a major tantrum, well it was his 10th tantrum actually, so moved club. I went and visited 4 clubs before I found a very sympathetic CFI who patted me down and we discussed all my problems flying vices, strengths and weaknesses ... progress was rapid once again. and I am enjoying the new club, so quickly out of the K21 and into the Junior as I don't fit in any wooden gliders!

Junior great little Glider to fly Air brakes like an escalator and great early single seater, "God I was scared on that first aero tow". As an Extra, nearly all my early flights apart from 5 were winch and I enjoyed the winch once I got over the fear! but aero tow can be just as challenging.

Own Glider ... The one I bought was a Standard Cirrus, Perhaps not the best Glider to buy as a first ownership Glider, but being a PPL and have many hours in LAA aircraft + others including Longez, Katanas, Arrows, Robins, Airtourer, Slingsby T67 to name a few of my power aircraft in my log book. I felt confident I got it right. Std Cirrus, big cockpit, and will take 6ft 4 depending on your build, everything is to hand and the only problem so far is pulling up the undercarriage leaver, Putting it down is fine but up is a pain in the ass! Problem 2 like most early solo pilots you can get a bit over confident in your glider everybody wizzing about and you struggling to find the thermals! Workload goes up ! You come down faster and faster till you go off in a really good 2 seater .... My club has a Duo Discus and I have been fortunate to fly it three times cross country with a really good pilot who is considerate and takes his time to explain what sensations I should be feeling ( it helped a lot ).
My Glider...... would I buy a glider outright on my own again? .....Maybe but thats me, My view is perhaps next I might share a glider in a very small group, but i have been in a group before and every time you want to fly it it's gone !

Over confidence, When you have flown your glider several times and it is quicker than the club aircraft and more slippery and retractable and smaller airbrakes !!!! and a bugger to get out of the trailer and rig every time you want to fly it ! Lots of bad language here ! ..... don't rush to buy a glider, wait look and sit in plenty !

Did I get it wrong .... Only once so far on finals... but it was in my Std Cirrus over confident and poor decision making made me beat myself up for weeks.... Is the Cirrus right as a first Glider .... it was for me, but perhaps not for everybody, Skills, ability, practice. Winter is over its now March 2014 I am back in the K21 for 3 or 4 flights one or two in the Junior and one in the Duo when its a nice day and back in my Cirrus ... Hope this helped.

Bronze Exam to finish and renewal of my RT licence and cross country experience on my own this year is the goal, As a addition I have bought a very expensive set of covers for the Cirrus so I don't have to rig it every time..

On Wednesday, 30 October 2013 19:17:44 UTC, wrote:
Good evening,



I need some assistance!



I am an early solo pilot looking to buy my first glider, but don't really know what to go for! I want it for local soaring, but eventually to go cross country in it.



The slight issue is that I am 6`4 tall and 17.5 stone - arguably too heavy, but the question is what to go for.



I'll obviously need a roomy cockpit!



Any thoughts would be appreciated!



On Wednesday, 30 October 2013 19:17:44 UTC, wrote:
Good evening,



I need some assistance!



I am an early solo pilot looking to buy my first glider, but don't really know what to go for! I want it for local soaring, but eventually to go cross country in it.



The slight issue is that I am 6`4 tall and 17.5 stone - arguably too heavy, but the question is what to go for.



I'll obviously need a roomy cockpit!



Any thoughts would be appreciated!

I'm 6'4" and 235. How comfortable are you in the Kestral and how much room do you have to move around in around your hips and shoulders. My hips and shoulders are wide.

Thanks, Jon 949.770.0700

Why are recreational glider cockpits so small? If someone built a glider with a 25% larger cockpit, would it hurt the L/D that much?

Are all high performance gliders built for racing and by consequence make the sport unattractive for larger people?

How many people retire from gliding because they no longer fit in their gliders? How many never try the sport because they find the cockpit claustrophobic and uncomfortable? How many teenagers solo only to grow too big to fit in a glider?

If Eastern Europeans grow larger over time, will glider cockpits get bigger?

If the sport offered an extra large cockpit, would it increase participation levels?

Has anyone modified a two place glider to accommodate an extra large pilot?

6'5" 230lb. ASW20. Seat back removed. Feels great after 6 hours in the air. Astronaut foam and a hand pump inflatable lumbar cushion velcroed to my chute.