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#1
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Reducing collision hazard at contests
3. Change the scoring formula so that fencing risks becomes a less of a winning strategy. Today you get no reward for being the lone finisher and are heavily penalized for being the lone outlander. The scoring formula heavily incentivizes sticking to the gaggle. There are plenty of ways to change this.
Here's one of them: https://www.fai.org/sites/default/fi...r_1_p rop.pdf |
#2
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Reducing collision hazard at contests
Thanks for the many considered responses here that came from competition pilots. It is good to know that the US proposal to FAI was accepted. After reading the material that Ron Gleason linked, it’s pretty obvious that the US improved scoring method will reduce the gaggle incentive that is so evident at the WGC level. This is sure to improve the WGC mid-air statistics over the long run and make for a better contest for the other reasons cited as well.
The suggestion of my original post would likely go much further to reduce gaggling and improve safety yet there were quite a few concerns expressed - a couple of which I think are valid. The suggestion #2 made by Alex in his May 16 comment, is quite an excellent idea. I now would lend my support to that idea as the best solution -- better really than my own suggestion at the top of the thread. After thinking about it, I would suggest a small change to Alex’s #2 proposal. Alex said that each contestant picks his own three secret start times for each day. That would be itself something of a burdensome process and could lead to collusion scenarios among contestants. Here would be my alternative suggestion wherein the contest sets everyone’s start times: At the beginning of the contest, each contestant is given a list of unique secret start times, one for each contest day. Each such start time is a randomly generated number between 0 and 19. This sheet of start times is analogous to the the sheet of grid positions that we are typically given at the start of contests except that it is custom created for each contestant and is delivered in secret (probably sent to contestants by email). The number for each day is your modulo-20 start time. An example: For day 1, my secret number is 7. That means that my start will be scored as 12:07 or 12:27 or 12:47 or 13:07 or …. Let’s say that the gate opens on day 1 at 12:15, I can start immediately at 12:15 which would be wasting 8 minutes or I could hold off until one of my later start times. This system will most surely spread the field. It will reduce gaggle tendency, reduce start time roulette and reduce leeching. Safety will be improved quite a bit. As a small further refinement, a massage of the random numbers could ensure even better spreading so that for a field of less than 21 contestants, no two contestants get the same secret number and for a field between 21 and 41, no more than two pilots get the same time assignment, etc. This might lead to some interesting, and I think harmless, pre-launch interaction among contestants. Those who are most concerned about leeching will surely want to keep their secret number secret. Those lower on the score sheet might choose to publish their start time with the hope of finding out in advance who they will be starting with for the day and perhaps getting a little advantage in arranging to fly together before the start. Can contest pilots get behind this type of approach? |
#3
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Reducing collision hazard at contests
No more rules. Just race.
This is the gliding equivalent of drafting in cycling, NASCAR, Speed Skating, Etc. All of which could cause serious or fatal injuries if done wrong. Penalizing pilots for flying in close proximity to each other serves no purpose. Heads outside the cockpit, stop staring at the gadgets and gizmos, and go have a good old fashioned race! |
#4
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Reducing collision hazard at contests
At 21:14 16 May 2018, Sierra Whiskey wrote:
No more rules. Just race. This is the gliding equivalent of drafting in cycling, NASCAR, Speed Skating, Etc. All of which could cause serious or fatal injuries if done wrong. Penalizing pilots for flying in close proximity to each other serves no purpose. Heads outside the cockpit, stop staring at the gadgets and gizmos, and go have a good old fashioned race! As I see it the only practical way to prevent large groups of pilots staying together is to do it in the same way as they do in cycling and rallying - have a time trial where each pilot starts at a different time. A sport where everyone starts at the same time, or at a time of the participant's choosing, will lead to some sort of interaction between them. Look at match racing in sailing, it's all about using the rules of sailing to beat your opponent. This means doing away with the pilot going through a start line at a time of their choosing and goes to starting at the start of the flight. This is how it used to be before the days of start lines and loggers. Do competitors want to do this? Competition gliding has been trying to move away from this towards pilots having the choice of exactly when to start and this will inevitably led to grouping. It may not make you go faster than your opponent but it can help you avoid doing worse. Chris |
#5
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Reducing collision hazard at contests
As regards "leeching" (as opposed to "leaching, with reference to a soluble chemical or mineral, drain away from soil, ash, or similar material by the action of percolating liquid, especially rainwater)
Remember George Moffat's famous quote. "There just isn't a variometer like another sailplane." |
#6
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Reducing collision hazard at contests
Suppose all pilots would be required to have a semi-loud, annoying, Beep - Beep - Beep sound whenever they were in close proximity to another glider?
Tom Knauff |
#7
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Reducing collision hazard at contests
On Sunday, May 20, 2018 at 10:10:12 AM UTC-4, wrote:
Suppose all pilots would be required to have a semi-loud, annoying, Beep - Beep - Beep sound whenever they were in close proximity to another glider? Tom Knauff They already do - its called a vario. |
#8
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Reducing collision hazard at contests
It is called a flarm. We have it all The Club planes and most of The private planes. (Øsf. Denmark)
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#9
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Reducing collision hazard at contests
On Monday, May 21, 2018 at 10:12:47 AM UTC-7, Henning Pedersen wrote:
It is called a flarm. We have it all The Club planes and most of The private planes. (Øsf. Denmark) Flarm is fantastic. It's widely adopted in the US now too. My own guess is that Flarm is preventing about half of the collisions at contests where everyone has it. Doesn't that leave plenty enough collision hazard to motivate this discussion and plenty enough reason to continue trying to fix the problem? |
#10
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Reducing collision hazard at contests
When ever I see something about safety (really "how to survive feeding my Sailplane addiction) I usually read most of the posts until they go of subject.
In this case (while trying to rationalize hwy I am doing contests) I decided to google it.... "cause of glider accidents" just as a fact finding mission. Try it..... pretty interesting http://www.airsailing.org/downloads/...ion%20R24B.pdf I have a FLARM - a transponder - thinking about putting a stob into the vertical.... would probably paint the glider hot pink if some one proved it avoided a collision The question is " will rule changes add significantly to safety, REALLY - or get us to the point where the sport is no longer enjoyable" - I know this is a very serious subject and even one collision is one to many - but - many of the suggestions seriously affect the core concepts of the sport and make an already difficult sport to score and follow, even harder. The newest concept in Sailplane racing "Grand Prix" is in a totally different direction from most of the posts I have read in this thread. Seems to me to be a measure twice cut once issue - the unintended consequences need to be thought about. WH |
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