OLV GPS 36 approach question

Even though I have had my IFR ticket for 2 years, every flight feels
like my first :-)

Perfectly understandable. Unless you fly profesionally, it takes
quite a long time years-wise to have encountered and digested most
types of situations.

I fly the approaches in this area over and over again with students,
so these approaches are more mine than the controller's. I'm used to
telling them how I want to fly them.

I doubt the controller even noticed that you didn't descend to the
altitude he gave you, or he would have said something.

In article ,
Greg Esres wrote:

BTW, MVA in that area is probably 2,000 feet, so you were safe at
2,100, but not in compliance with the procedure.

What is the MSA on the approach chart?

What is the MSA on the approach chart?

No MSA on TAA RNAV approaches.

On the ILS, I think it's 2,500, due to a very tall tower north of the
airport.

Greg Esres wrote:
What is the MSA on the approach chart?

No MSA on TAA RNAV approaches.

On the ILS, I think it's 2,500, due to a very tall tower north of the
airport.


MVA trumps MSA, and that is what was issued. Published 2800 would be
required if no radar.

BillJ wrote in newsk5Cg.15$H84.900
@eagle.america.net:

MVA trumps MSA, and that is what was issued. Published 2800 would be
required if no radar.

Once I am cleared for an approach, am I no longer under "vectors" but own
navigation?

In other words, MVA no longer is applicable since I am responsible for
executing the approach without vector instructions?

Allen

MVA trumps MSA, and that is what was issued. Published 2800 would be
required if no radar.

MSA is irrelevant, except in an emergency. And MVA only trumps the
2800 if being RADAR VECTORED to the final approach course. In this
case, the pilot was flying a non-radar procedure in a radar
environment. ATC should have given him no altitude below 2800.

Allen:

When I orginally read your post, I pictured you making a right base
entry to the procedure, even though you mentioned DOCAP. Anyway, my
reply was based on this incorrect mental image.

The published intermediate segment after DOCAP has a published altitude
of 2,100, so the controller's instruction was appropriate. The
published altitude prior to that fix is for the holding pattern course
reversal, which you were not required to perform coming from the
straight-in area.

Sorry for the confusion.

wrote in news:1155147361.341080.40380
@p79g2000cwp.googlegroups.com:

The published intermediate segment after DOCAP has a published altitude
of 2,100, so the controller's instruction was appropriate. The
published altitude prior to that fix is for the holding pattern course
reversal, which you were not required to perform coming from the
straight-in area.

Hi Greg,

Bear with me as I am really trying to understand this....

Looking at the FAA version of the approach plate, profile section, it has
2800 to DOCAP, then descend to 2100 at CICAL for the final approach into
OLV.

Based on what you are saying, since I am pretty much a straight in approach
that it's allowable to be cleared by ATC below the profile altitude of 2800
10 miles BEFORE DOCAPS?

10 miles outside DOCAPS, my instructions were descend and maintain 2100,
cleared for the GPS 36.

Allen

A Lieberma wrote:


Bear with me as I am really trying to understand this....

Looking at the FAA version of the approach plate, profile section, it has
2800 to DOCAP, then descend to 2100 at CICAL for the final approach into
OLV.

Based on what you are saying, since I am pretty much a straight in approach
that it's allowable to be cleared by ATC below the profile altitude of 2800
10 miles BEFORE DOCAPS?

10 miles outside DOCAPS, my instructions were descend and maintain 2100,
cleared for the GPS 36.

Allen

Think in terms of being vectored to the final approach course on an ILS.
When done correctly, the controller will vector you at an altitude
below the G/S.

If this approach were an ILS and the controller was setting you up to
intercept the "final" perhaps 3 miles prior to CICAL on a 30 degree
intercept angle. The controller would almost certainly descend you to
2,100 to intercept. He might have you at 2,100 10 miles prior to intercept.

Do you see any difference with your handling, albeit with a new ATC/AIM
procedure?

Looking at the FAA version of the approach plate, profile section, it
has
2800 to DOCAP, then descend to 2100 at CICAL for the final approach
into
OLV.

The 2,800 ft segment you see is the Hold-in-Lieu. A HIL is part of the
initial segment, which doesn't begin until the IAF. From your
direction of flight, the HIL wasn't required for you, so its altitude
didn't apply.

Regardless, ATC has a right to assign you an altitude to maintain until
you arrive at a certain fix; only AFTER you arrive there do published
altitudes apply. Until then, you're relying on their MVA to keep you
safe.

If they had cleared you to ECILE, and told you to maintain 2,100, then
there would have been a problem. You're fine until you get to ECILE,
but the moment you pass that fix, you're in violation of 91.177.

Same thing if you had come from the north direction to DOCAP. You'd be
fine at 2,100 until the fix, but the HIL is required from this
direction and you'd be in violation of 91.177 once you started the hold
entry.


Sam: The fix DOCAP is labeld IF/IAF. Does the segment from DOCAP to
CICAL use initial or intermediate ROC ?