Biggest and smallest aviators

I remember reading that one of VF-17s Corsair pilots was so small he had to
"get creative" to be able to use enough rudder on take off. Sometimes you
see a picture in which it looks like there is a contortionist gorilla in the
cockpit.

I know there are some size guideliness, and also know that there are waivers
signed here and there.

My topic proposal is:

Do you have some good stories to tell about guys that were really too big or
too small to be in that particular cockpit?
_____________
José Herculano

"José Herculano" wrote in message
...
I remember reading that one of VF-17s Corsair pilots was so small he had to
"get creative" to be able to use enough rudder on take off. Sometimes you
see a picture in which it looks like there is a contortionist gorilla in
the cockpit.

I know there are some size guideliness, and also know that there are
waivers signed here and there.

My topic proposal is:

Do you have some good stories to tell about guys that were really too big
or too small to be in that particular cockpit?

A long time ago, I knew an AF pilot at Tyndall who regularly flew with about
ten pounds of lead weights in his speed jeans. One day he forgot to put the
weights in, plane caught fire, he was too light to eject, rode that flaming
beast (delta dart) all the way back, landed it, walked away smoking.

On Sun, 30 Jan 2005 22:19:03 GMT, "Aardvark J. Bandersnatch, MP, LP,
BLT, ETC." wrote:


"José Herculano" wrote in message
. ..
I remember reading that one of VF-17s Corsair pilots was so small he had to
"get creative" to be able to use enough rudder on take off. Sometimes you
see a picture in which it looks like there is a contortionist gorilla in
the cockpit.

I know there are some size guideliness, and also know that there are
waivers signed here and there.

My topic proposal is:

Do you have some good stories to tell about guys that were really too big
or too small to be in that particular cockpit?

A long time ago, I knew an AF pilot at Tyndall who regularly flew with about
ten pounds of lead weights in his speed jeans. One day he forgot to put the
weights in, plane caught fire, he was too light to eject, rode that flaming
beast (delta dart) all the way back, landed it, walked away smoking.


"Too light to eject"??? Never heard of such a thing during 23 years of
tactical aviation riding a whole variety of boom-seats. We had a
maintainer commit suicide at Korat in '73 by prying the banana links
off of the sear on a Martin-Baker in an F-4 while leaning over the
canopy rail. Seat didn't seem to mind that nobody was sitting in it.

The only thing lead weights in the pockets of the G-suit would do is
insure severe leg fractures in any sort of high speed ejection.


Ed Rasimus
Fighter Pilot (USAF-Ret)
"When Thunder Rolled"
www.thunderchief.org

Ed Rasimus wrote:
"Too light to eject"??? Never heard of such a thing during 23 years of

I think this means the seat will accelerate so quickly that there is
a much higher than normal risk of injury. I've heard of this once or
twice, usually regarding female pilots.

Putting lead weights in your pockets seems like an unlikely solution
to me too.

Ed Rasimus wrote:
On Sun, 30 Jan 2005 22:19:03 GMT, "Aardvark J. Bandersnatch, MP, LP,
BLT, ETC." wrote:


"José Herculano" wrote in message
...
I remember reading that one of VF-17s Corsair pilots was so small
he had to "get creative" to be able to use enough rudder on take
off. Sometimes you see a picture in which it looks like there is a
contortionist gorilla in the cockpit.

I know there are some size guideliness, and also know that there are
waivers signed here and there.

My topic proposal is:

Do you have some good stories to tell about guys that were really
too big or too small to be in that particular cockpit?

A long time ago, I knew an AF pilot at Tyndall who regularly flew
with about ten pounds of lead weights in his speed jeans. One day he
forgot to put the weights in, plane caught fire, he was too light to
eject, rode that flaming beast (delta dart) all the way back, landed
it, walked away smoking.


"Too light to eject"??? Never heard of such a thing during 23 years of
tactical aviation riding a whole variety of boom-seats. We had a
maintainer commit suicide at Korat in '73 by prying the banana links
off of the sear on a Martin-Baker in an F-4 while leaning over the
canopy rail. Seat didn't seem to mind that nobody was sitting in it.

There are limits for minimum ejection weight -- one of the things that had
to be done to accomodate female pilots was test seats at lighter weights.
AFAIK, it's not so much that the seat won't go with a lighter passenger, but
that it will accelerate too fast and increase the odds of injury.

This article from the Air Force Safety Center talks about the testing done
to expand the weight range of the ACES II seat. Looks more like a testing
and validation issue than a hardware modification, but I think later seats
may have a weight setting that can be adjusted to maintain a safe ejection
speed.

http://afsafety.af.mil/magazine/htdo...ag98/aces2.htm

Likewise, BUMED lists a minimum weight of 100 pounds for all aircrew
designated for ejection-seat aircraft, and notes that aircrew under 135
(IIRC) are to be cautioned that they are at increased risk of injury during
ejection. See Section 1.2:

http://www.nomi.med.navy.mil/Nami/Wa...pics/exams.htm

--
Tom Schoene Replace "invalid" with "net" to e-mail
"Our country, right or wrong. When right, to be kept right, when
wrong to be put right." - Senator Carl Schurz, 1872

http://www.nomi.med.navy.mil/Nami/Wa...pics/exams.htm

What a pain... I would have met this standards... failed my flight school
application because I had 18/20 uncorrected in the right eye.

Perhaps for the best, because cocky as I was at the time I'd probably had
bought the farm performing an immature stunt... but it still pains.

_____________
José Herculano

aardvark- A long time ago, I knew an AF pilot at Tyndall who regularly flew
with about
ten pounds of lead weights in his speed jeans. One day he forgot to put the
weights in, plane caught fire, he was too light to eject, BRBR


Balderdash...there is no minimum weight to eject.


P. C. Chisholm
CDR, USN(ret.)
Old Phart Phormer Phantom, Turkey, Viper, Scooter and Combat Buckeye Phlyer

Ya put lead weights in your pockets of yer g suit and you may end up with no
feet...when ya eject.
P. C. Chisholm
CDR, USN(ret.)
Old Phart Phormer Phantom, Turkey, Viper, Scooter and Combat Buckeye Phlyer

....And - if you DO keep your legs - lead weights make for an interesting
swim once you splash.

--
Mike Kanze

"We all know the modern American campus, or think we do: concentration
camps of the mind where students are tortured by baby-boom professors whose
speech codes, leftist politics and unseemly obsession with race, sex and
gender have distorted the ideal of higher education."

- Philip Terzian


"Pechs1" wrote in message
...
Ya put lead weights in your pockets of yer g suit and you may end up with
no
feet...when ya eject.
P. C. Chisholm
CDR, USN(ret.)
Old Phart Phormer Phantom, Turkey, Viper, Scooter and Combat Buckeye
Phlyer

Another reason for multiple rounds of sliders and autodog, for those
so-afflicted.

--
Mike Kanze

"We all know the modern American campus, or think we do: concentration
camps of the mind where students are tortured by baby-boom professors whose
speech codes, leftist politics and unseemly obsession with race, sex and
gender have distorted the ideal of higher education."

- Philip Terzian


"Thomas Schoene" wrote in message
k.net...
Ed Rasimus wrote:
On Sun, 30 Jan 2005 22:19:03 GMT, "Aardvark J. Bandersnatch, MP, LP,
BLT, ETC." wrote:


"José Herculano" wrote in message
...
I remember reading that one of VF-17s Corsair pilots was so small
he had to "get creative" to be able to use enough rudder on take
off. Sometimes you see a picture in which it looks like there is a
contortionist gorilla in the cockpit.

I know there are some size guideliness, and also know that there are
waivers signed here and there.

My topic proposal is:

Do you have some good stories to tell about guys that were really
too big or too small to be in that particular cockpit?

A long time ago, I knew an AF pilot at Tyndall who regularly flew
with about ten pounds of lead weights in his speed jeans. One day he
forgot to put the weights in, plane caught fire, he was too light to
eject, rode that flaming beast (delta dart) all the way back, landed
it, walked away smoking.


"Too light to eject"??? Never heard of such a thing during 23 years of
tactical aviation riding a whole variety of boom-seats. We had a
maintainer commit suicide at Korat in '73 by prying the banana links
off of the sear on a Martin-Baker in an F-4 while leaning over the
canopy rail. Seat didn't seem to mind that nobody was sitting in it.

There are limits for minimum ejection weight -- one of the things that had
to be done to accomodate female pilots was test seats at lighter weights.
AFAIK, it's not so much that the seat won't go with a lighter passenger,
but that it will accelerate too fast and increase the odds of injury.

This article from the Air Force Safety Center talks about the testing done
to expand the weight range of the ACES II seat. Looks more like a testing
and validation issue than a hardware modification, but I think later seats
may have a weight setting that can be adjusted to maintain a safe ejection
speed.

http://afsafety.af.mil/magazine/htdo...ag98/aces2.htm

Likewise, BUMED lists a minimum weight of 100 pounds for all aircrew
designated for ejection-seat aircraft, and notes that aircrew under 135
(IIRC) are to be cautioned that they are at increased risk of injury
during ejection. See Section 1.2:

http://www.nomi.med.navy.mil/Nami/Wa...pics/exams.htm

--
Tom Schoene Replace "invalid" with "net" to e-mail
"Our country, right or wrong. When right, to be kept right, when
wrong to be put right." - Senator Carl Schurz, 1872