Best PDA/PNA for FLARM display?

I flew with a portable PowerFLARM at the Uvalde pre-worlds, and I have
a 'brick' unit on order for delivery sometime this fall/winter. As I
wait for delivery, I am contemplating how to integrate it into my
current instrumentation setup.

One possibility I am considering is to not use the brick's Butterfly
display at all, assuming I can get adequate display/warnings from
FLARM data displayed on one of the many PDA/PNA moving map displays
available these days.

Does anyone have experience with FLARM display on WinPilot PRO v9,
SeeYou Mobile on an Oudie or other display, ClearNav, or other? Is
the integrated display good enough to replace the Butterfly display?

TIA,

TA

On Aug 24, 6:47*am, Frank Paynter wrote:

One possibility I am considering is to not use the brick's Butterfly
display at all, assuming I can get adequate display/warnings from
FLARM data displayed on one of the many PDA/PNA moving map displays
available these days.


Don't only consider the threat display capability. You also need the
audio alarms and the control functions some of which, I think, will
require the display of separate settings pages. Some alternate
display devices may support all the required functionality but it
seems unlikely that anyone would have been able to test that yet.

Andy

The ILEC SN10 optionally displays 2 FLARM pages:
- threat (giant graphic for fast visualization of threat direction), and
- neighbors (kinda like PF "radar" display, no map overlay)
I used it at Uvalde, and as a few bozos tested collision
warnings for me so I can attest it works great.

I understand ClearNAV has something similar.

Most if not all current PDA software has FLARM displays...

Hope this helps,
Best Regards, Dave "YO electric"

I haven't studied any PDA/FLARM interface except LK8000. I assume other
software have similar capabilities and limitations. I have come to the
conclusion that the Butterfly display provides an instant view that isn't
available on the PDA and the PDA provides additional information not
available on Butterfly.

The following link provides information that may assist in your research.
http://www.bware.it/LK8000/LK8000_MANUAL_122.pdf

My current plan is to connect the PowerFLARM brick data to my PDA via serial
cable and my smart vario data via BlueTooth.

Wayne
HP-14 "6F"
http://tinyurl.com/N990-6F



"Frank Paynter" wrote in message
...

I flew with a portable PowerFLARM at the Uvalde pre-worlds, and I have
a 'brick' unit on order for delivery sometime this fall/winter. As I
wait for delivery, I am contemplating how to integrate it into my
current instrumentation setup.

One possibility I am considering is to not use the brick's Butterfly
display at all, assuming I can get adequate display/warnings from
FLARM data displayed on one of the many PDA/PNA moving map displays
available these days.

Does anyone have experience with FLARM display on WinPilot PRO v9,
SeeYou Mobile on an Oudie or other display, ClearNav, or other? Is
the integrated display good enough to replace the Butterfly display?

TIA,

TA

On Aug 24, 8:47*am, Frank Paynter wrote:
I flew with a portable PowerFLARM at the Uvalde pre-worlds, and I have
a 'brick' unit on order for delivery sometime this fall/winter. *As I
wait for delivery, I am contemplating how to integrate it into my
current instrumentation setup.

One possibility I am considering is to not use the brick's Butterfly
display at all, assuming I can get adequate display/warnings from
FLARM data displayed on one of the many PDA/PNA moving map displays
available these days.

Does anyone have experience with FLARM display on WinPilot PRO v9,
SeeYou Mobile on an Oudie or other display, ClearNav, or other? *Is
the integrated display good enough to replace the Butterfly display?

TIA,

TA

Clearnav shows surrounding traffic, but like the others I have seen
(winpilot, seeyou), the display is designed to complement, not
substitute for, the collision display.

I connected powerflarm to clearnav at Uvalde. The good news is, it
works. Clearnav shows the other gliders. But when there is a collision
alert powerflarm shows you which glider is the problem by making the
other glider larger and red. Clearnav (for now) doesn't show which
other glider is causing the interference. The CN display is also not
designed to take over the functionality of the big powerflarm button.

Of course with powerflarm in the US for a grand total of about 3 weeks
so far, it's an easy bet that the other software will all be modified
over the winter to take better advantage of it. Still, conventional
wisdom seems to be to put the PF display somewhere where you can see
it.

John Cochrane

Ozflarm connected to Altair works really well. Altair uses XCSoar but is
somewhat different to XCSoar for PDAs. I presume a powerflarm would work
with Altair. There is 2 displays, one pop-up display that shows all traffic
in green but conflcts in red with a direction vector, plus another display
on main map including climb-rates and comp IDs if loaded.
Tom

At 15:00 24 August 2011, John Cochrane wrote:
On Aug 24, 8:47=A0am, Frank Paynter wrote:
I flew with a portable PowerFLARM at the Uvalde pre-worlds, and I have
a 'brick' unit on order for delivery sometime this fall/winter. =A0As I
wait for delivery, I am contemplating how to integrate it into my
current instrumentation setup.

One possibility I am considering is to not use the brick's Butterfly
display at all, assuming I can get adequate display/warnings from
FLARM data displayed on one of the many PDA/PNA moving map displays
available these days.

Does anyone have experience with FLARM display on WinPilot PRO v9,
SeeYou Mobile on an Oudie or other display, ClearNav, or other? =A0Is
the integrated display good enough to replace the Butterfly display?

TIA,

TA

Clearnav shows surrounding traffic, but like the others I have seen
(winpilot, seeyou), the display is designed to complement, not
substitute for, the collision display.

I connected powerflarm to clearnav at Uvalde. The good news is, it
works. Clearnav shows the other gliders. But when there is a collision
alert powerflarm shows you which glider is the problem by making the
other glider larger and red. Clearnav (for now) doesn't show which
other glider is causing the interference. The CN display is also not
designed to take over the functionality of the big powerflarm button.

Of course with powerflarm in the US for a grand total of about 3 weeks
so far, it's an easy bet that the other software will all be modified
over the winter to take better advantage of it. Still, conventional
wisdom seems to be to put the PF display somewhere where you can see
it.

John Cochrane

Hi Frank,

SeeYou Mobile and your ClearNav can currently display FLARM traffic and
climb rates, etc.

I'm not aware of any soaring software or hardware that can currently display
the ADS-B or transponder traffic data from the PowerFLARM. I'm not certain
whether or not the PowerFLARM will send ADS-B and transponder traffic data
out. I am optimistic that it will do so in the long run. I'm also
optimistic that soaring software will be able to display the ADS-B and
transponder traffic data in the long run. Until then, I highly recommend
using a PowerFLARM display in your cockpit. It would be a shame if the
PowerFLARM was trying to alert you to nearby ADS-B or transponder traffic
and you weren't listening.

Good Soaring,

Paul Remde
Cumulus Soaring, Inc.

"Frank Paynter" wrote in message
...
I flew with a portable PowerFLARM at the Uvalde pre-worlds, and I have
a 'brick' unit on order for delivery sometime this fall/winter. As I
wait for delivery, I am contemplating how to integrate it into my
current instrumentation setup.

One possibility I am considering is to not use the brick's Butterfly
display at all, assuming I can get adequate display/warnings from
FLARM data displayed on one of the many PDA/PNA moving map displays
available these days.

Does anyone have experience with FLARM display on WinPilot PRO v9,
SeeYou Mobile on an Oudie or other display, ClearNav, or other? Is
the integrated display good enough to replace the Butterfly display?

TIA,

TA

PowerFLARM does not yet send out serial-port data on ADS-B traffic or PCAS alerts. That is under developed by FLARM. Third party vendors will have to add support for those Flarm enhancements.

There is a lot of detail to ask about when looking at different FLARM 3rd party software integration. What exact feature of FLARM and PowerFLARM (especially) does it support, e.g. does it support FLARMNET - the ability to tie glider information to an Flarm/ICAO ID etc. (and I'm not even sure if that will be used in the USA - I hope so).

Be very careful of any third party vendor who just says "we support Flarm" that is a pretty useless level of detail. You have to look in detail, often at the user manual to see exactly what is there and what works.

I am looking at SeeYou Mobile talking to a PowerFLARM in front of me at the moment. I see the Flarm rings but no Flarm equipped gliders flying nearby....

Darryl

Hi Darryl,

Good points.

I know that SeeYou Mobile does support FLARMNet. You just download the
FLARMNet data file and save it in the "Radar" directory on the PDA or PNA.

The PowerFLARM display currently does not support FLARMNet. It may in the
future.

I don't know whether or not the ClearNav supports FLARMNet.

I have registered my PowerFLARM on FLARMNet. It is pretty easy to do.
FLARM recommends using your gliders ICAO ID - which is easy to get. But you
do need to convert it to a Hex number. That is easy if you know how. The
calculator in Window can make the conversion. The PowerFLARM manual shows
where to get your ICAO ID from the FAA web site.

Paul Remde

"Darryl Ramm" wrote in message
...

PowerFLARM does not yet send out serial-port data on ADS-B traffic or PCAS
alerts. That is under developed by FLARM. Third party vendors will have to
add support for those Flarm enhancements.

There is a lot of detail to ask about when looking at different FLARM 3rd
party software integration. What exact feature of FLARM and PowerFLARM
(especially) does it support, e.g. does it support FLARMNET - the ability to
tie glider information to an Flarm/ICAO ID etc. (and I'm not even sure if
that will be used in the USA - I hope so).

Be very careful of any third party vendor who just says "we support Flarm"
that is a pretty useless level of detail. You have to look in detail, often
at the user manual to see exactly what is there and what works.

I am looking at SeeYou Mobile talking to a PowerFLARM in front of me at the
moment. I see the Flarm rings but no Flarm equipped gliders flying nearby...

Darryl

XCSoar for Altair shows Flarm really well, not sure if XCSoar on a PDA does
as well.
Tom

At 15:24 24 August 2011, Paul Remde wrote:
Hi Frank,

SeeYou Mobile and your ClearNav can currently display FLARM traffic and
climb rates, etc.

I'm not aware of any soaring software or hardware that can currently
display
the ADS-B or transponder traffic data from the PowerFLARM. I'm not
certain

whether or not the PowerFLARM will send ADS-B and transponder traffic data

out. I am optimistic that it will do so in the long run. I'm also
optimistic that soaring software will be able to display the ADS-B and
transponder traffic data in the long run. Until then, I highly recommend

using a PowerFLARM display in your cockpit. It would be a shame if the
PowerFLARM was trying to alert you to nearby ADS-B or transponder traffic

and you weren't listening.

Good Soaring,

Paul Remde
Cumulus Soaring, Inc.

"Frank Paynter" wrote in message
...
I flew with a portable PowerFLARM at the Uvalde pre-worlds, and I have
a 'brick' unit on order for delivery sometime this fall/winter. As I
wait for delivery, I am contemplating how to integrate it into my
current instrumentation setup.

One possibility I am considering is to not use the brick's Butterfly
display at all, assuming I can get adequate display/warnings from
FLARM data displayed on one of the many PDA/PNA moving map displays
available these days.

Does anyone have experience with FLARM display on WinPilot PRO v9,
SeeYou Mobile on an Oudie or other display, ClearNav, or other? Is
the integrated display good enough to replace the Butterfly display?

TIA,

TA