the thrill of flying interview is here!

A liberal response to what I've read...

There's no denying what you experienced. If you were thrilled by
something, then that's what happened - whether it was planned or came
from a surprise.

Whether it was appropriate OR how you handled it is a question for
debate. I've really learned something from reading your discussion.
Understanding these moments is important to my research (and to being
a successful pilot I would imagine).

Whether I should be asking these questions here... I can see that in a
student forum (where the training is in minimising the potential for
thrill, and at worst how to cope with it if it does happen) my
original questioning looks like it extols the virtues of thrill. For
me to fully understand how thrills happen, it's also vital to
understand how they are negated. In this instance through serious long
hard repetitive training and the accumulation of experience.

There is a difference between "thrill seeking" - actually looking to
be thrilled which I see can get you killed as a pilot ; and
"appreciating thrill" - which is about acknowledging it's existence
and learning to cope with it's affects.

I'm not a thrill seeker, and even though the thrill ride industry is
where the money's at - I'm not driven by their stereotypical notion of
what constitutes thrill. My research is equally applicable to
increasing emotional experiences in architecture. I'm interested in
controlling the existence of thrill NOT seeking to constantly "push it
to the max".

I've been particularly interested in the development of remotely
piloted fighter aircraft where the pilots were underperforming because
of their diminished levels of arousal (being sat on the ground and not
in the air). In this research NASA is seeking to actually raise levels
of arousal to increase performance, not reduce it.

I trained as an aeronautical engineer and worked for British Aerospace
Military Aircraft for 5 years during the early 90's working on Tornado
ADV's, Hawk 200's and the Eurofighter (now called Typhoon). I don't
fly, but I'm familiar with test pilots, and also ejector seat
experiments (worked for a short while with Martin Baker). I left and
studied as an Industrial Design Engineer and now work part time as a
research fellow in the Interaction Design department at the Royal
College of Art. Another branch of my research is working with
scientists from MIT to develop a system to objectively sense the
emotion of thrill, which could have implications to safety systems.

The particular research I'm conducting here is wholly SUBJECTIVE. I
only have my own experiences to draw on. This is an exercise in trying
to understand someone else's emotions, then attempting to faithfully
replicate these in a machine. The machine is a by-product, an end
focus - HOWEVER developing a process to dissect and understand what
thrills us and how; that's the real challenge to this research! As
this research is subjective, an arts grant was appropriate. Other more
objective work I've done in the past has been funded by science and
industry sectors.

This has been the most active group I've approached with my questions.
The invitation to be interview still stands. Remember it's from the
perspective that I am interested in you as an individual, and your
capacity to be thrilled. NOT about classifying pilots as thrill
seekers. Because my work concentrates primarily on thrill, and not the
activity (e.g. flying) that elicited the emotion, it may appear
flippant. I hope I've convinced you that this research is serious.

That all said, you've already provided an absolutely huge resource of
opinions, which I'm very grateful for. What's missing are expanded
personal stories that capture the essence of what you say in a format
that is easily comparable to other people's experiences. Those who
feel they can help explain themselves further, then please take the
interview. Everyone else, thank you for such a fantastic discussion.

Brendan Walker

On 22 Oct 2003 04:35:36 -0700, (BW) wrote in
Message-Id: :

Whether I should be asking these questions here... I can see that in a
student forum (where the training is in minimising the potential for
thrill, and at worst how to cope with it if it does happen) my
original questioning looks like it extols the virtues of thrill.

Right. The phrase you chose in your subject, "the thrill of flying,"
seems to erroneously imply that flying is about thrill seeking. Your
exclusion of the rec.aviation.student newsgroup from your former list
of target groups demonstrates your sincerity and attempt at prudence.

You might privately contact individuals who responded positively to
your original post (if they provided valid e-mail addresses), and I
would expect that you might find a greater number of willing
candidates for your questionnaire in rec.aviation.military.

I suspect, that the susceptibility to experiencing thrill (threshold)
and the relative intensity experienced by subjects exposed to the same
stimuli (magnitude) are genetically based and highly individualistic
as are the human perception of aural and olfactory sensations. (Each
individual's aural spectral response is unique, and many individuals
perceive perfumes quite differently.)

Are you able to provide a hint of what your research is revealing so
far?

"Larry Dighera" wrote in message
...
Your
exclusion of the rec.aviation.student newsgroup from your former list
of target groups demonstrates your sincerity and attempt at prudence.

The student group was NOT excluded. This thread appears there as it does
here. The fact that is does appear there was the reason for my initial
response. If it had just been on "piloting" I never would have responded, as
I have absolutely nothing to do with this group and don't post here unless
circumstances warrant it; as this post demonstrates.
In fact, this identical post from BW you have answered has been posted under
me over there.

Dudley Henriques
International Fighter Pilots Fellowship
Commercial Pilot/ CFI Retired
For personal email, please replace
the z's with e's.
dhenriquesATzarthlinkDOTnzt

On Wed, 22 Oct 2003 15:51:14 GMT, "Dudley Henriques"
wrote in Message-Id:
.net:


"Larry Dighera" wrote in message
.. .
Your exclusion of the rec.aviation.student newsgroup from your former list
of target groups demonstrates your sincerity and attempt at prudence.

The student group was NOT excluded. This thread appears there as it does
here.

True. But the OP's followup article* (to which my comment was
directed) does not; he trimmed the student group from the
'Newsgroups:' header.

The fact that is [sic] does appear there was the reason for my initial
response. If it had just been on "piloting" I never would have responded, as
I have absolutely nothing to do with this group and don't post here unless
circumstances warrant it; as this post demonstrates.

You just read rec.aviation.piloting without posting? Interesting.

I am not subscribed to rec.aviation.student, and attempt to omit that
newsgroup from my followups to articles cross posted there unless it
seems appropriate to include the student group.

There are now only 25 articles in this thread on my ISP's nntp server
at this time in the rec.aviation.student newsgroup; none of them are
authored by me.

In fact, this identical post from BW you have answered has been posted under
me over there.

Forgive me, but I'm not readily able to divine your meaning in that
sentence. The phrase 'posted under me' is troubling; you're implying
that a message appears in your newsreader client program visually
positioned beneath one you posted, not that it was attributed to your
authorship, right? The meaning's got to be precise for us pedants to
comprehend. :-) Otherwise, the ambiguities are overwhelming and
necessitate guessing at the author's meaning (always risky).

At any rate, I only see BD's original article* and no others authored
by him, none authored by me, and only one** authored by you in this
thread in the student newsgroup at this time.

* Message-ID:
** Message-ID:
k.net

On Wed, 22 Oct 2003 17:52:47 GMT, Larry Dighera
wrote in Message-Id: :

At any rate, I only see BD's original article* and no others authored
by him, none authored by me, and only one** authored by you in this
thread in the student newsgroup at this time.


CORRECTION:

BD's original article should have been noted as:

* Message-ID:

"Larry Dighera" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 22 Oct 2003 15:51:14 GMT, "Dudley Henriques"
wrote in Message-Id:
.net:


"Larry Dighera" wrote in message
.. .
Your exclusion of the rec.aviation.student newsgroup from your former
list
of target groups demonstrates your sincerity and attempt at prudence.

The student group was NOT excluded. This thread appears there as it does
here.

True. But the OP's followup article* (to which my comment was
directed) does not; he trimmed the student group from the
'Newsgroups:' header.

The fact that is [sic] does appear there was the reason for my initial
response. If it had just been on "piloting" I never would have responded,
as
I have absolutely nothing to do with this group and don't post here
unless
circumstances warrant it; as this post demonstrates.

You just read rec.aviation.piloting without posting? Interesting.

I am not subscribed to rec.aviation.student, and attempt to omit that
newsgroup from my followups to articles cross posted there unless it
seems appropriate to include the student group.

There are now only 25 articles in this thread on my ISP's nntp server
at this time in the rec.aviation.student newsgroup; none of them are
authored by me.

In fact, this identical post from BW you have answered has been posted
under
me over there.

Forgive me, but I'm not readily able to divine your meaning in that
sentence. The phrase 'posted under me' is troubling; you're implying
that a message appears in your newsreader client program visually
positioned beneath one you posted, not that it was attributed to your
authorship, right? The meaning's got to be precise for us pedants to
comprehend. :-) Otherwise, the ambiguities are overwhelming and
necessitate guessing at the author's meaning (always risky).

At any rate, I only see BD's original article* and no others authored
by him, none authored by me, and only one** authored by you in this
thread in the student newsgroup at this time.

* Message-ID:
** Message-ID:
k.net

Not sure at all how all this factors in with the two newsgroups scenario,
as I really don't have the time to research exactly what has been posted to
what and by whom. The initial post by BW was cross posted to about six
newsgroups including "student" and "piloting"
I caught it on the student group. When I posted a response, my browser
wouldn't recognize any of the groups the OP had used except this one and
"student". Instead of trimming out "piloting" which I should have done, and
always do because I don't have anything at all to do with this group or the
people here, I accidentally posted the reply to both groups. That started
the usual responses from "piloting". I trimmed all further responses to
"piloting" until I noticed that BW had posted the exact same post to both
you here and to me over there. You of course had stated that you felt his
trimming of "student" to be a positive factor. I merely have pointed out
that his messages on this issue have been posted on "student" and as far as
I can determine, no such "trimming" has occurred.
As for me reading "piloting" and not posting; I don't frequent this group
for several reasons, and try never to post here. I wouldn't be posting here
now if it wasn't for the mistake I made in not trimming my initial answer
properly. I take it this exchange between you and I might involve one more
post or perhaps none at all, then I will no longer be either reading here or
posting here.
Dudley Henriques
International Fighter Pilots Fellowship
Commercial Pilot/ CFI Retired
For personal email, please replace
the z's with e's.
dhenriquesATzarthlinkDOTnzt

"Dudley Henriques"
snip
As for me reading "piloting" and not posting; I don't frequent this group
for several reasons, and try never to post here. I wouldn't be posting
here
now if it wasn't for the mistake I made in not trimming my initial answer
properly. I take it this exchange between you and I might involve one more
post or perhaps none at all, then I will no longer be either reading here
or
posting here.


Hmm??? Wonder what all he doesn't like about r.a.p.?

Oh well, maybe he just doesn't have the time to read another newsgroup.

That's what I'm going with :-)

--
Montblack