Denver Terminal Area Chart Question - BVR vor/dme

Does anybody know why on the Denver Terminal Area Chart, the Byers (BVR
113.5) vor/dme facility is charted without the compass ring that are on most
vortacs? It's the only one I've seen charted like this. Byers is located
33NM on the 090 radial of DVV (the Denver International Vortac).

Thanks, Robert

"Robert Easton" wrote in message ...
Does anybody know why on the Denver Terminal Area Chart, the Byers (BVR
113.5) vor/dme facility is charted without the compass ring that are on most
vortacs? It's the only one I've seen charted like this. Byers is located
33NM on the 090 radial of DVV (the Denver International Vortac).

The presence or absence of the compass rose on a VOR has no meaning.
It is purely at the discretion of the cartographer to omit it when he feels it
would make the chart too cluttered.

The presence or absence of the compass rose on a VOR has no meaning.
It is purely at the discretion of the cartographer to omit it when he
feels it
would make the chart too cluttered.

All right, this makes sense to me. But as someone who is still a student, I
have to ask a question here. Let's say that I'm planning to fly along a
specific VOR radial, and that this radial is not part of an airway. What I
normally do is draw a line on the chart, and then read the radial on this
compass rose. But without the compass rose, how am I supposed to determine
the radial that I need to follow? Most of the VORs in this area have not
been adjusted to keep pace with magnetic variation, and are therefore a few
degrees off from both both the true course and the magnetic course.

I know that I can look up each VORs magnetic variation setting on
airnav.com, but what if that wasn't available?

There might be a better way, but I'd just approximate it by looking at the
VOR's nearby. You won't be more than a few degrees off.

Michael

"Geoffrey Barnes" wrote in message
ink.net...
The presence or absence of the compass rose on a VOR has no meaning.
It is purely at the discretion of the cartographer to omit it when he
feels it
would make the chart too cluttered.

All right, this makes sense to me. But as someone who is still a student,
I
have to ask a question here. Let's say that I'm planning to fly along a
specific VOR radial, and that this radial is not part of an airway. What
I
normally do is draw a line on the chart, and then read the radial on this
compass rose. But without the compass rose, how am I supposed to
determine
the radial that I need to follow? Most of the VORs in this area have not
been adjusted to keep pace with magnetic variation, and are therefore a
few
degrees off from both both the true course and the magnetic course.

I know that I can look up each VORs magnetic variation setting on
airnav.com, but what if that wasn't available?

Variation differences are VOR specific. Each VOR is adjusted individually or
ignored for years individually. Using a nearby VOR is not a solution.

There are only three possibilities. 1) Look up the variation for that
particular VOR in your always handy AF/D to determine a radial to fly; 2)
compute a magnetic heading from the VOR for the course you want to fly,
start flying it, and determine which radial you are on; or 3) use an airway
that is charted from that VOR to determine its variance.
--
-------------------------------
Travis
"Michael 182" wrote in message
news:hcRTb.209885$I06.2322774@attbi_s01...
There might be a better way, but I'd just approximate it by looking at the
VOR's nearby. You won't be more than a few degrees off.

Michael

"Geoffrey Barnes" wrote in message
ink.net...
The presence or absence of the compass rose on a VOR has no meaning.
It is purely at the discretion of the cartographer to omit it when he
feels it
would make the chart too cluttered.

All right, this makes sense to me. But as someone who is still a
student,
I
have to ask a question here. Let's say that I'm planning to fly along a
specific VOR radial, and that this radial is not part of an airway.
What
I
normally do is draw a line on the chart, and then read the radial on
this
compass rose. But without the compass rose, how am I supposed to
determine
the radial that I need to follow? Most of the VORs in this area have
not
been adjusted to keep pace with magnetic variation, and are therefore a
few
degrees off from both both the true course and the magnetic course.

I know that I can look up each VORs magnetic variation setting on
airnav.com, but what if that wasn't available?

Yeah you're right. Having said that, I'd look at a nearby VOR and estimate.
I'm not saying the FAA or a CFI would approve, but the reality is that
estimating would be plenty close enough.

Michael


"Travis Marlatte" wrote in message
ink.net...
Variation differences are VOR specific. Each VOR is adjusted individually
or
ignored for years individually. Using a nearby VOR is not a solution.

There are only three possibilities. 1) Look up the variation for that
particular VOR in your always handy AF/D to determine a radial to fly; 2)
compute a magnetic heading from the VOR for the course you want to fly,
start flying it, and determine which radial you are on; or 3) use an
airway
that is charted from that VOR to determine its variance.
--
-------------------------------
Travis
"Michael 182" wrote in message
news:hcRTb.209885$I06.2322774@attbi_s01...
There might be a better way, but I'd just approximate it by looking at
the
VOR's nearby. You won't be more than a few degrees off.

Michael

"Geoffrey Barnes" wrote in message
ink.net...
The presence or absence of the compass rose on a VOR has no meaning.
It is purely at the discretion of the cartographer to omit it when
he
feels it
would make the chart too cluttered.

All right, this makes sense to me. But as someone who is still a
student,
I
have to ask a question here. Let's say that I'm planning to fly along
a
specific VOR radial, and that this radial is not part of an airway.
What
I
normally do is draw a line on the chart, and then read the radial on
this
compass rose. But without the compass rose, how am I supposed to
determine
the radial that I need to follow? Most of the VORs in this area have
not
been adjusted to keep pace with magnetic variation, and are therefore
a
few
degrees off from both both the true course and the magnetic course.

I know that I can look up each VORs magnetic variation setting on
airnav.com, but what if that wasn't available?

"Geoffrey Barnes" wrote in message
ink.net...

All right, this makes sense to me. But as someone who is still a student,
I
have to ask a question here. Let's say that I'm planning to fly along a
specific VOR radial, and that this radial is not part of an airway. What
I
normally do is draw a line on the chart, and then read the radial on this
compass rose. But without the compass rose, how am I supposed to
determine
the radial that I need to follow? Most of the VORs in this area have not
been adjusted to keep pace with magnetic variation, and are therefore a
few
degrees off from both both the true course and the magnetic course.


Any airways at all from this VOR? Use your protractor to measure the angle
between the radial defining the charted airway and the line you just drew.

"Steven P. McNicoll" wrote in message
ink.net...
Any airways at all from this VOR? Use your protractor to measure the
angle
between the radial defining the charted airway and the line you just drew.

Or even better, just drop the plotter on top of the existing airways and
line up the appropriate degree markings with the airways. Then just read
the magnetic course from the drawn course line underneath the plotter. No
need to measure any angles at all.

This will be better than applying the local variation, since VOR radials are
not kept 100% up-to-date with changes in variation. Using existing airway
headings will ensure that the drawn course matches the radio indication,
even if not the magnetic compass.

Pete

Geoffrey Barnes wrote:

All right, this makes sense to me. But as someone who is still a student, I
have to ask a question here. Let's say that I'm planning to fly along a
specific VOR radial, and that this radial is not part of an airway. What I
normally do is draw a line on the chart, and then read the radial on this
compass rose. But without the compass rose, how am I supposed to determine
the radial that I need to follow?

Work out the magnetic course with your plotter and fly that radial. Use pilotage
to adjust your course if necessary. One or two degrees inaccuracy in the VOR isn't
enough to cause any real navigation problems. To put it in perspective, if you
blindly follow a radial and the VOR is 2 degrees off, you will be less than half
a mile off course at the end of 20 miles.

George Patterson
Love, n.: A form of temporary insanity afflicting the young. It is curable
either by marriage or by removal of the afflicted from the circumstances
under which he incurred the condition. It is sometimes fatal, but more
often to the physician than to the patient.

"Geoffrey Barnes" wrote in message ink.net...
course.

I know that I can look up each VORs magnetic variation setting on
airnav.com, but what if that wasn't available?

You're supposed to have sufficient reference material (like the AF/D) with
you during your preflight planning. Them's the rules.