On balance, are Moving Map PNAs better than Cambridge 302/303 styleLCD navigation?

Now that folks have experience with both approaches, are Moving Map PNAs in fact a big step forward?

Do the advantages of Moving Map PNAs outweigh the disadvantages?

On Wednesday, May 22, 2013 11:25:54 AM UTC-4, son_of_flubber wrote:
Now that folks have experience with both approaches, are Moving Map PNAs in fact a big step forward?



Do the advantages of Moving Map PNAs outweigh the disadvantages?

Heck yes! I kind of look at it this way:

- Generation 1: LCD-based displays (including pointers, numerical values, stuff like that) give you basic situational awareness. I'm 10 miles from the turnpoint and it's "over there". A big step up from a paper map and trying to figure out if that lake there and that road there are really Smithsburg or maybe it's Jonesville.

- Generation 2: Initial moving maps added much more visual information, so you can quickly compare the view out the window to the view on the screen. This allows you to also anticipate terrain options (hey, there's a ridge over there) or other landing options (3 airports jsut off course to the right).

- Generation 3: The latest fully integrated devices mix situational awareness with tactical awareness for racing or serious XC. If you invest some time toward configuring to your liking and chose a device that maps to your style (some people like to fiddle with numbers and values; I like pictures), you can not only know where you are going but where to go to optimize distance on tasks and stuff like that.

The longer answer is much longer, but it's just heck yes with more details.

P3

On Wednesday, May 22, 2013 5:25:54 PM UTC+2, son_of_flubber wrote:
Now that folks have experience with both approaches, are Moving Map PNAs in fact a big step forward?



Do the advantages of Moving Map PNAs outweigh the disadvantages?

Yes.

Setup correctly (and they DO take some setting up), a good PNA map will tell you at a glance where you are, which way you need to go, and what landing places are in range all around you. You simply cannot get all that data from a text display.

My setup has an SN10 for the important tactical data, focused on the task or destination ahead. My PNA (Oudie/SYM) gives me a much bigger overview of the task, ground track, landable fields, and some additional data that I can look at when time permits.

Kirk
66

On Wednesday, May 22, 2013 12:29:40 PM UTC-4, kirk.stant wrote:

My setup has an SN10 for the important tactical data, focused on the task or destination ahead. My PNA (Oudie/SYM) gives me a much bigger overview of the task, ground track, landable fields, and some additional data that I can look at when time permits.


So you're saying that you prefer to see tactical priority #1 information on SN10 and overview priority #2 info on PNA. Do you think that this is because you first develop the habits/skills of using the SN10 and you later added the PNA as a welcome enhancement, or is there some inherent advantage to splitting the information between the two devices?

Assuming you had your choice of "speed-to-fly" varios, would you then be happy putting all of the other information on the PNA? Or do you see a problem with putting too much information on the PNA and mixing tactical with overview information on the same device?

On Wednesday, May 22, 2013 12:15:09 PM UTC-4, Papa3 wrote:

- Generation 3: The latest fully integrated devices mix situational awareness with tactical awareness for racing or serious XC. If you invest some time toward configuring to your liking and chose a device that maps to your style (some people like to fiddle with numbers and values; I like pictures), you can not only know where you are going but where to go to optimize distance on tasks and stuff like that.

And this integration and readability may or may not be possible on a smallish barely bright enough screen depending on the acuity of your close vision and the design/customization of the graphics. Hence the popularity of the two device approach:

On Wednesday, May 22, 2013 12:29:40 PM UTC-4, kirk.stant wrote:

My setup has an SN10 for the important tactical data, focused on the task or destination ahead. My PNA (Oudie/SYM) gives me a much bigger overview of the task, ground track, landable fields, and some additional data that I can look at when time permits.


Or if your close vision is so-so, you can invest in something like ClearNav..

Do the advantages of Moving Map PNAs outweigh the disadvantages?

Absolutely without a doubt PNAs are the way to go. This is along the trajectory from compass+map, to bearing+distance (303), to not-so-bright displays (PDA and some PNAs), finally to the super bright PNAs.

BTW: What disadvantages do you speak of? There are some but I'm interested in your take.

- John

On Wednesday, May 22, 2013 8:49:39 PM UTC+2, son_of_flubber wrote:

Assuming you had your choice of "speed-to-fly" varios, would you then be happy putting all of the other information on the PNA? Or do you see a problem with putting too much information on the PNA and mixing tactical with overview information on the same device?

Well, since I don't like "speed to fly" varios, it's kind of a moot point. Seriously, I thing the new crop of varios cram too much information into a small display, which is the exact opposite of what I want. I have the info I need in big numbers on my SN10 custom page, some of it repeated on my Oudie screens, and think we should be using more aural cues instead of more little bugs on varios. I prefer to pick a speed to fly and stick to it instead of following a speed command.

Now if I had an AOA indicator with nice bright LEDs, I wouldn't even need to look at the airspeed when slow (pattern, gaggling, etc). That would be really trick!

Kirk

Do the advantages of Moving Map PNAs outweigh the disadvantages?



Heck yes! I kind of look at it this way:



- Generation 1: LCD-based displays (including pointers, numerical values, stuff like that) give you basic situational awareness. I'm 10 miles from the turnpoint and it's "over there". A big step up from a paper map and trying to figure out if that lake there and that road there are really Smithsburg or maybe it's Jonesville.



- Generation 2: Initial moving maps added much more visual information, so you can quickly compare the view out the window to the view on the screen. This allows you to also anticipate terrain options (hey, there's a ridge over there) or other landing options (3 airports jsut off course to the right).



- Generation 3: The latest fully integrated devices mix situational awareness with tactical awareness for racing or serious XC. If you invest some time toward configuring to your liking and chose a device that maps to your style (some people like to fiddle with numbers and values; I like pictures), you can not only know where you are going but where to go to optimize distance on tasks and stuff like that.



The longer answer is much longer, but it's just heck yes with more details.



P3

Generation 4: Google glasses , with full voice input and output ('"Ok, glasses, final glide?... 300 over Mc 4 15 miles to go .... Average? .. 2 knots up..)

John Cochrane

On Wednesday, May 22, 2013 3:18:43 PM UTC-4, JohnDeRosa wrote:

BTW: What disadvantages do you speak of? There are some but I'm interested in your take.


I deliberately left the disadvantages unspecified in my question. I thought that they would be forthcoming in the discussion.

I'm inexperienced with PNAs, but wary. I know that I don't want to be that kid I saw yesterday riding down the sidewalk towards me on his bike, left hand on the handlebars, and right hand texting.

Yes, that's always the fear but for the most part they just become another
instrument you glance at while flying. The only intensive fiddling I've had
with them has involved trying to add waypoints to MAT tasks. I WILL note
that you have to learn to use them properly OUT OF THE PLANE, however.