Engine failure on final

The discussion about cutting power on final reminded me of something
I've been puzzled about for some time now.

If you fly final with some amount of power (which I gather most people
do -- I always have) that seems to guarantee that if you lose your
engine on final you will land short, and there's pretty much nothing you
can do about it. Is that true? Or have I missed something? What
should you do if you lose your engine just after turning base to final?

rg

"Ron Garret"
If you fly final with some amount of power (which I gather most people
do -- I always have) that seems to guarantee that if you lose your
engine on final you will land short, and there's pretty much nothing you
can do about it. Is that true?

Unless you do every landing power off with room to spare, yes. Or, aim for
the mid point of a 2500' plus field. There are ways to do it. But, almost
nobody does. Base turn should be doable power off in most cases in a 172 or
similar glider.

Or have I missed something? What
should you do if you lose your engine just after turning base to final?

Land short. That's why the slow idle check during the run-up is important.

moo

On Fri, 21 Jan 2005 00:56:22 -0800, Ron Garret
wrote:

If you fly final with some amount of power (which I gather most people
do -- I always have) that seems to guarantee that if you lose your
engine on final you will land short, and there's pretty much nothing you
can do about it. Is that true?

Yes, that's true, and it's why the Old Timers taught power-off
landings, and it's why I fly them routinely.

(To tell the truth, I also like the feeling of whooshing down without
that engine blatting away. Perhaps I was a glider pilot in another
life.)


-- all the best, Dan Ford

email (put Cubdriver in subject line)

Warbird's Forum: www.warbirdforum.com
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the blog: www.danford.net

Recently, Ron Garret posted:

The discussion about cutting power on final reminded me of something
I've been puzzled about for some time now.

If you fly final with some amount of power (which I gather most people
do -- I always have) that seems to guarantee that if you lose your
engine on final you will land short, and there's pretty much nothing
you can do about it. Is that true? Or have I missed something? What
should you do if you lose your engine just after turning base to
final?

As I was taught, the point of flying safely is to always have a viable
option. So, I fly tight patterns and make power-off landings as a rule. If
I make it to the pattern, I can make it to a runway, engine or no.

Neil

On Fri, 21 Jan 2005 12:41:39 GMT, "Neil Gould"
wrote in
::

As I was taught, the point of flying safely is to always have a viable
option. So, I fly tight patterns and make power-off landings as a rule. If
I make it to the pattern, I can make it to a runway, engine or no.

Truly? So when you're #5 in the pattern (which necessitates a
looooong, extended downwind leg) you just fly the pattern at 2,000'
then?

On Fri, 21 Jan 2005 00:56:22 -0800, Ron Garret
wrote:

The discussion about cutting power on final reminded me of something
I've been puzzled about for some time now.

If you fly final with some amount of power (which I gather most people
do -- I always have) that seems to guarantee that if you lose your
engine on final you will land short, and there's pretty much nothing you
can do about it. Is that true? Or have I missed something? What
should you do if you lose your engine just after turning base to final?

rg

Can anyone cite an instance when a pilot lost his engine while on
final and landed short because of it?

Thanks, Corky Scott

If you fly final with some amount of power (which I gather most people
do -- I always have) that seems to guarantee that if you lose your
engine on final you will land short, and there's pretty much nothing
you
can do about it. Is that true?
************************************************** ***********************

Worse than that, is that I have noticed that many pilots seem to take
off using power... That guarantees that they absolutely will land short
if they lose power... What should we all do about that?

Denny jeez

Larry Dighera wrote:
On Fri, 21 Jan 2005 12:41:39 GMT, "Neil Gould"
wrote in
::

As I was taught, the point of flying safely is to always have a
viable
option. So, I fly tight patterns and make power-off landings as a
rule. If
I make it to the pattern, I can make it to a runway, engine or no.

Truly? So when you're #5 in the pattern (which necessitates a
looooong, extended downwind leg) you just fly the pattern at 2,000'
then?

Noting you can do about requested extended downwind leg. But you could
keep your decent low or delay the decent to give you more reach. Also
consider a flapless landing to keep the glide angle shallow. Wait to
add flaps when you are certain to make the runway.

neil wrote:
As I was taught, the point of flying safely is to always have a viable
option. So, I fly tight patterns and make power-off landings as a rule. If
I make it to the pattern, I can make it to a runway, engine or no.

Larry Dighera wrote:
Truly? So when you're #5 in the pattern (which necessitates a
looooong, extended downwind leg) you just fly the pattern at 2,000'
then?

I was about to ask that, too. Depending on the airport, it would be
tricky to make power-off approaches from the downwind *as a rule*. Not
only is there the situation Larry mentioned above (3rd, 4th or 5th
behind who-knows-what), but also airports with two runways that are
staggered by 1500' or so and ATCs frequently instructing you to switch
runways at the last minute.

So what do you do when you are on 1/4-mile final and you spot a coyote
or two playing around in the middle of the runway? This has happened to
me repeatedly in Santa Fe and just serves to remind me that I want some
backup power just in case the landing isn't assured. Perhaps you don't
see this where you fly "routinely" but it could always be something else.
I typically pull the throttle all the way back to idle about 1/4 mile
out, Cessna 172.

-david
--
David Gunter
Santa Fe, NM

In Cub Driver wrote:
On Fri, 21 Jan 2005 00:56:22 -0800, Ron Garret
wrote:

If you fly final with some amount of power (which I gather most people
do -- I always have) that seems to guarantee that if you lose your
engine on final you will land short, and there's pretty much nothing
you can do about it. Is that true?

Yes, that's true, and it's why the Old Timers taught power-off
landings, and it's why I fly them routinely.

(To tell the truth, I also like the feeling of whooshing down without
that engine blatting away. Perhaps I was a glider pilot in another
life.)


-- all the best, Dan Ford

email (put Cubdriver in subject line)

Warbird's Forum: www.warbirdforum.com
Piper Cub Forum: www.pipercubforum.com
the blog: www.danford.net