alternative to iGlide for iPhone (6 plus)

I have been using iGlide now for about 20 flights, and I really don't like it very much. It is riddled with bugs (which I have duly reported to Butterfly only to hear "yes, we're aware of that"), the user experience is terrible (and I speak as someone who has worked in user interaction and user experience for years), and the documentation is woefully out of date (last updated 2/2013) and incomplete. So I have wasted $33.

Are there other apps that people recommend for IoS?

thanks, bob

On Wednesday, 13 May 2015 14:08:42 UTC+1, Bob Pasker wrote:
I have been using iGlide now for about 20 flights, and I really don't like it very much. It is riddled with bugs (which I have duly reported to Butterfly only to hear "yes, we're aware of that"), the user experience is terrible (and I speak as someone who has worked in user interaction and user experience for years), and the documentation is woefully out of date (last updated 2/2013) and incomplete. So I have wasted $33.

Are there other apps that people recommend for IoS?

thanks, bob

Cannot recommend or otherwise, but the main choice for iOs apart from iGlide is Winpilot. Like many others, I used Winpilot for many years on iPaqs and they did a great job. The iOs version is completely different, and I cannot say whether or not it is better than iGlide.

What bugs are you seeing?

On Wednesday, May 13, 2015 at 6:08:42 AM UTC-7, Bob Pasker wrote:
I have been using iGlide now for about 20 flights, and I really don't like it very much. It is riddled with bugs (which I have duly reported to Butterfly only to hear "yes, we're aware of that"), the user experience is terrible (and I speak as someone who has worked in user interaction and user experience for years), and the documentation is woefully out of date (last updated 2/2013) and incomplete. So I have wasted $33.

Are there other apps that people recommend for IoS?

thanks, bob

Just goes to show that there are many different tastes in the world. I am curious though, you say it is "riddled with bugs" - what have you run into as examples? I am aware only of a couple of fairly obscure ones and have flown with it for many hours.

Winpilot for iOS has promise, but it does not work very well on the 6+ and the up time before a hard crash seems to be only a few minutes.

Funny. I find iGlide to be excellent (particularly the UI) and have found very few bugs (both were addresses within days for me) after using it extensively for over 2 years (so far) in numerous contests and cross country flights and in many environments (mountains, flatlands, complex airspace). In my experience, some people just do not get iOS fundementals. Could this, perhaps, be the case for you? What did you not like?

I also have extensive UI design background. I find the iGlide UI to be far superior to any other small portable device soaring software including XC Soar. It requires far less steps to do the majority of critical ot common functions and most pilots I have spoken with find it intuitive and simple to use. This is just my opinion of course.

I have extensive experience with WinPilot, Strepla, SeeYou (Oudie 1 and 2) and XC Soar as well on multiple devices.

I am a member of a firm which primarily consults (and also helps develop) custom mobile applications (typically financial services). UI differentiators (IP, etc) is usually a critical topic.

Please list here (since you flamed it so sharply) all the bugs you found with iGlide, especially the ones the developer acknowledged as "known" bugs. Since you bought the $39 version of iGlide, clearly you have no experience with tasking, etc., correct?

If you want to to talk about terrible UI, I give you SeeYou mobile. Would you not agree?

Then again, UI is a fairly subjective subject and a matter of personal preference.

Can you provide an example of soaring UI's that you approve of?

Thanks!

On Wednesday, May 13, 2015 at 8:49:47 AM UTC-7, Sean Fidler wrote:
Funny. I find iGlide to be excellent (particularly the UI) and have found very few bugs (both were addresses within days for me) after using it extensively for over 2 years (so far) in numerous contests and cross country flights and in many environments (mountains, flatlands, complex airspace). In my experience, some people just do not get iOS fundementals. Could this, perhaps, be the case for you? What did you not like?

I also have extensive UI design background. I find the iGlide UI to be far superior to any other small portable device soaring software including XC Soar. It requires far less steps to do the majority of critical ot common functions and most pilots I have spoken with find it intuitive and simple to use. This is just my opinion of course.

I have extensive experience with WinPilot, Strepla, SeeYou (Oudie 1 and 2) and XC Soar as well on multiple devices.

I am a member of a firm which primarily consults (and also helps develop) custom mobile applications (typically financial services). UI differentiators (IP, etc) is usually a critical topic.

Please list here (since you flamed it so sharply) all the bugs you found with iGlide, especially the ones the developer acknowledged as "known" bugs.. Since you bought the $39 version of iGlide, clearly you have no experience with tasking, etc., correct?

If you want to to talk about terrible UI, I give you SeeYou mobile. Would you not agree?

Then again, UI is a fairly subjective subject and a matter of personal preference.

Can you provide an example of soaring UI's that you approve of?

Thanks!

To be fair, different people see things differently. He said he had a background in UI, if this was working for Microsoft for example, then I have a different world view and no common language even to communicate with him. There are people that love Windows 8. I no longer try to understand them, just wish them luck.

He does have a point about the documentation being behind, but then like any good iOS app, you don't really need it.

The universal response to all those I have demonstrated iGlide to, even die-hard SYM and XCSoar fans, was, "wow - that looked easy!". In not a single instance has anyone said, "yeah, I can do that quicker and easier on my SYM/XCSoar....". The only complaint in the past has been, is it sunlight viewable? - and that has been largely addressed by the 6/6+.

I have not used SYM for many hours because it leaves such a bad taste in my mouth, however I have had more bugs and more crashing bugs on XCSoar and Winpilot, both running on an Avier, than on iGlide.

On Wednesday, 13 May 2015 16:49:47 UTC+1, Sean Fidler wrote:
Funny. I find iGlide to be excellent (particularly the UI) and have found very few bugs (both were addresses within days for me) after using it extensively for over 2 years (so far) in numerous contests and cross country flights and in many environments (mountains, flatlands, complex airspace). In my experience, some people just do not get iOS fundementals. Could this, perhaps, be the case for you? What did you not like?

I also have extensive UI design background. I find the iGlide UI to be far superior to any other small portable device soaring software including XC Soar. It requires far less steps to do the majority of critical ot common functions and most pilots I have spoken with find it intuitive and simple to use. This is just my opinion of course.

I have extensive experience with WinPilot, Strepla, SeeYou (Oudie 1 and 2) and XC Soar as well on multiple devices.

I am a member of a firm which primarily consults (and also helps develop) custom mobile applications (typically financial services). UI differentiators (IP, etc) is usually a critical topic.

Please list here (since you flamed it so sharply) all the bugs you found with iGlide, especially the ones the developer acknowledged as "known" bugs.. Since you bought the $39 version of iGlide, clearly you have no experience with tasking, etc., correct?

If you want to to talk about terrible UI, I give you SeeYou mobile. Would you not agree?

Then again, UI is a fairly subjective subject and a matter of personal preference.

Can you provide an example of soaring UI's that you approve of?

Thanks!


It would be much appreciated if one of you guys who prefer the iGlide and XCSoar UI to SYM could put up a video of setting a task on iGlide and/or XCS.. Would anyone be prepared to do that?

I find it much easier to set tasks and to change zoom levels on SYM than on XCS, but maybe I am missing the efficient ways to do things in XCS. I particularly like being able to customise the map screen of SYM fully flexibly to use my preferred combination of overlays and navboxes, and stats are very easy to find. For iGlide, I played with the lite version and it seemed hopeless, but I never looked at a manual and have never seen the full version so have not done it justice. However, since I have just changed my phone from iOs to a Galaxy S6 I am not going to pursue iGlide.

On Wednesday, May 13, 2015 at 3:21:13 PM UTC-7, waremark wrote:
On Wednesday, 13 May 2015 16:49:47 UTC+1, Sean Fidler wrote:
Funny. I find iGlide to be excellent (particularly the UI) and have found very few bugs (both were addresses within days for me) after using it extensively for over 2 years (so far) in numerous contests and cross country flights and in many environments (mountains, flatlands, complex airspace). In my experience, some people just do not get iOS fundementals. Could this, perhaps, be the case for you? What did you not like?

I also have extensive UI design background. I find the iGlide UI to be far superior to any other small portable device soaring software including XC Soar. It requires far less steps to do the majority of critical ot common functions and most pilots I have spoken with find it intuitive and simple to use. This is just my opinion of course.

I have extensive experience with WinPilot, Strepla, SeeYou (Oudie 1 and 2) and XC Soar as well on multiple devices.

I am a member of a firm which primarily consults (and also helps develop) custom mobile applications (typically financial services). UI differentiators (IP, etc) is usually a critical topic.

Please list here (since you flamed it so sharply) all the bugs you found with iGlide, especially the ones the developer acknowledged as "known" bugs. Since you bought the $39 version of iGlide, clearly you have no experience with tasking, etc., correct?

If you want to to talk about terrible UI, I give you SeeYou mobile. Would you not agree?

Then again, UI is a fairly subjective subject and a matter of personal preference.

Can you provide an example of soaring UI's that you approve of?

Thanks!


It would be much appreciated if one of you guys who prefer the iGlide and XCSoar UI to SYM could put up a video of setting a task on iGlide and/or XCS. Would anyone be prepared to do that?

I find it much easier to set tasks and to change zoom levels on SYM than on XCS, but maybe I am missing the efficient ways to do things in XCS. I particularly like being able to customise the map screen of SYM fully flexibly to use my preferred combination of overlays and navboxes, and stats are very easy to find. For iGlide, I played with the lite version and it seemed hopeless, but I never looked at a manual and have never seen the full version so have not done it justice. However, since I have just changed my phone from iOs to a Galaxy S6 I am not going to pursue iGlide.

Tasking is a deeper subject, but zooming: On XCSoar, simply drag up or down to zoom. The problem there is the touch screen is really poor and making it recognize the drag is tedious and uncertain. On iGlide, simply pinch to zoom, like you do on every other iPhone app. To pan, just touch and drag, no need for a pan mode like XCSoar has. The touch screen on the iPhone 6 is very good, noticeably better than the 5s and worlds apart from the Oudie/Avier/V2. Heck even the old iPaqs were better than that. The redraw speed of the iPhone 6 and iGlide is also worlds apart.

....Use two fingers and drag to pan.

There are so many things in the XCSoar user's guide. How many of you
have looked through that? Not complete enough (at close to 200 pages)?
Jump in and make updates!

On 5/14/2015 10:12 AM, jfitch wrote:
On Wednesday, May 13, 2015 at 3:21:13 PM UTC-7, waremark wrote:
On Wednesday, 13 May 2015 16:49:47 UTC+1, Sean Fidler wrote:
Funny. I find iGlide to be excellent (particularly the UI) and have found very few bugs (both were addresses within days for me) after using it extensively for over 2 years (so far) in numerous contests and cross country flights and in many environments (mountains, flatlands, complex airspace). In my experience, some people just do not get iOS fundementals. Could this, perhaps, be the case for you? What did you not like?

I also have extensive UI design background. I find the iGlide UI to be far superior to any other small portable device soaring software including XC Soar. It requires far less steps to do the majority of critical ot common functions and most pilots I have spoken with find it intuitive and simple to use. This is just my opinion of course.

I have extensive experience with WinPilot, Strepla, SeeYou (Oudie 1 and 2) and XC Soar as well on multiple devices.

I am a member of a firm which primarily consults (and also helps develop) custom mobile applications (typically financial services). UI differentiators (IP, etc) is usually a critical topic.

Please list here (since you flamed it so sharply) all the bugs you found with iGlide, especially the ones the developer acknowledged as "known" bugs. Since you bought the $39 version of iGlide, clearly you have no experience with tasking, etc., correct?

If you want to to talk about terrible UI, I give you SeeYou mobile. Would you not agree?

Then again, UI is a fairly subjective subject and a matter of personal preference.

Can you provide an example of soaring UI's that you approve of?

Thanks!

It would be much appreciated if one of you guys who prefer the iGlide and XCSoar UI to SYM could put up a video of setting a task on iGlide and/or XCS. Would anyone be prepared to do that?

I find it much easier to set tasks and to change zoom levels on SYM than on XCS, but maybe I am missing the efficient ways to do things in XCS. I particularly like being able to customise the map screen of SYM fully flexibly to use my preferred combination of overlays and navboxes, and stats are very easy to find. For iGlide, I played with the lite version and it seemed hopeless, but I never looked at a manual and have never seen the full version so have not done it justice. However, since I have just changed my phone from iOs to a Galaxy S6 I am not going to pursue iGlide.
Tasking is a deeper subject, but zooming: On XCSoar, simply drag up or down to zoom. The problem there is the touch screen is really poor and making it recognize the drag is tedious and uncertain. On iGlide, simply pinch to zoom, like you do on every other iPhone app. To pan, just touch and drag, no need for a pan mode like XCSoar has. The touch screen on the iPhone 6 is very good, noticeably better than the 5s and worlds apart from the Oudie/Avier/V2. Heck even the old iPaqs were better than that. The redraw speed of the iPhone 6 and iGlide is also worlds apart.

--
Dan Marotta

thanks everyone who decided it was better to question my bona fides or my experience than to answer the question! but after wading through that stuff, it seems like there's only 1 alternative, WinPilot, which I'll try, and I guess it behoves me to continue to push on the butterfly guys to fix the bugs and improve the experience.