New CFI

Well, after lingering in these groups for a while and dreaming about the day
I could start flight lessons I think that day is finally here. I made a
trip out to the local FBO to figure out what exactly the next step is and
more specifically how I go about choosing a flight instructor. It turns out
that the experienced instructors all have pretty full schedules mainly
because of charter flights. There is at least one experienced CFI that
might have some openings. The manager of the FBO recommended that I talk to
a new CFI at the FBO. He is brand new. He just got his CFI a few months
ago and he is not instrument rated. I guess I am looking for any advice on
starting lessons with a "baby" CFI. Obvious concerns are 1. That he will be
hesitant to put his students up for a check ride because he will not want
them to fail. 2. I might miss out on the wisdom of a more experienced
pilot. 3. His lack of an instrument rating will make me miss out on some
wisdom in that area as well. Obviously I know that CFIs have to start with
a blank slate and I am not necessarily opposed to taking up lessons with
him. I'm just interested in any feedback.

Thanks!

Jeremy

My CFI was young enough to date my daughter, but I would not have approved a
marriage.

Your obvious concern #2 would be my biggest concern. Seasoned pilots will
be able to tell you more about the control, sounds and feel of the airplane,
weather, flying and life in general because of their seasoning.

My CFII is also young enough to date my daughter, but I would approve the
marriage because he is very intelligent. He may not have the experience of
a high hours pilot, but I respect his brains and am happy to have him as a
CFII.

I guess the ideal combination would be an instructor with lots of brains and
experience.

Kevin Dunlevy


"Mediacom" wrote in message
news:JmcNe.260850$x96.20579@attbi_s72...
Well, after lingering in these groups for a while and dreaming about the
day
I could start flight lessons I think that day is finally here. I made a
trip out to the local FBO to figure out what exactly the next step is and
more specifically how I go about choosing a flight instructor. It turns
out
that the experienced instructors all have pretty full schedules mainly
because of charter flights. There is at least one experienced CFI that
might have some openings. The manager of the FBO recommended that I talk
to
a new CFI at the FBO. He is brand new. He just got his CFI a few months
ago and he is not instrument rated. I guess I am looking for any advice
on
starting lessons with a "baby" CFI. Obvious concerns are 1. That he will
be
hesitant to put his students up for a check ride because he will not want
them to fail. 2. I might miss out on the wisdom of a more experienced
pilot. 3. His lack of an instrument rating will make me miss out on some
wisdom in that area as well. Obviously I know that CFIs have to start
with
a blank slate and I am not necessarily opposed to taking up lessons with
him. I'm just interested in any feedback.

Thanks!

Jeremy

"Kevin Dunlevy" wrote in message
...

My CFI was young enough to date my daughter, but I would not have approved
a
marriage.

In this century, the father "APPROVES" of a marriage? Good Lord, what
backwater part of the world do you live in?


My CFII is also young enough to date my daughter, but I would approve the
marriage because he is very intelligent. He may not have the experience
of
a high hours pilot, but I respect his brains and am happy to have him as a
CFII.


Well, hell, since it appears that you are more interested in marrying off
your daughter to a "qualified individual", why not find a willing CFII as
your son in law and hope that he is willing to give you a family discount on
your lessons?


Jim

"Mediacom" wrote in message
news:JmcNe.260850$x96.20579@attbi_s72...
[...] I guess I am looking for any advice on starting lessons with a
"baby" CFI. Obvious concerns are 1. That he will be hesitant to put his
students up for a check ride because he will not want them to fail. 2. I
might miss out on the wisdom of a more experienced pilot. 3. His lack of
an instrument rating will make me miss out on some wisdom in that area as
well. Obviously I know that CFIs have to start with a blank slate and I
am not necessarily opposed to taking up lessons with him. I'm just
interested in any feedback.

You have valid concerns. However, keep in mind that your primary
instructor, while they will be extremely important in setting habits you'll
keep with you the rest of your flying career, they are far from the only
instructor you'll ever fly with, and have an opportunity to learn from.

A risk with a more experienced instructor is that they may not know when to
quit offering "extras". There's a LOT of new concepts and things to learn
for a new pilot, and an experienced instructor could overwhelm that new
pilot with things that, while useful to know, aren't really relevant to
learning the fundamentals of flying an airplane.

As far as your specific concerns go: #1 is more an issue of professionalism,
and I haven't heard of it being a serious problem. At most flight schools,
the instructor (and especially a brand new instructor) is not the sole
arbiter of when you go for your check ride. So an instructor should, one
hopes, not fear of recommending a student too early because he has a chief
instructor to help him ensure that his determination is correct.

#2 might be a valid concern. However, a brand new instructor who has flown
with an experienced instructor may many of the same insights to offer. And
of course, as I pointed out above, as a fledgling pilot, you may not really
be ready to take on all of the little extra tidbits that might be offered by
a more experienced instructor.

#3 seems to me to be of the least concern. You'll have plenty of time to
learn about instrument flying if and when you train for your instrument
rating. There's very little that can be offered during primary training
that will make much sense to you. Near the very end, you might get to a
point where it does, but then you should be spending your time prepping for
the checkride.

One strong argument in favor of brand new instructors is that they are often
people who were students themselves, only recently. They have a lot more
empathy and recent experience for what you're going through and that MAY
translate into a more effective teaching process. No guarantees, but it's
always nice when the person you're sitting next to really understands what
you're going through, rather than it being a long distant memory.

It really does depend a lot on the instructor. Some new instructors are
there just for the hours, and they are looking forward to running off to
"the majors" as soon as they can. Others take the instructing job
seriously, and being new to the job have a lot more enthusiasm and energy
than many more experienced instructors.

And likewise, while it's a pretty safe bet that experienced instructors are
less likely to be building hours (they stuck around this long, why would
they leave? ), they may have less empathy for a primary student, and may
have lost some of the enjoyment of instructing. Or they could be great.
You never really know without either talking to previous students, or flying
with them, and this applies to all instructors regardless of experience.

Pete

"Peter Duniho" wrote in message
...

A risk with a more experienced instructor is that they may not know when
to quit offering "extras". There's a LOT of new concepts and things to
learn for a new pilot, and an experienced instructor could overwhelm that
new pilot with things that, while useful to know, aren't really relevant
to learning the fundamentals of flying an airplane.

This is actually a bad analogy. Although this is certainly possible with ANY
POOR instructor, for any GOOD experienced instructor, the exact opposite is
true.
The real issue to isolate with CFI's is the quality issue, and this can be
found both good and bad in both new and in more experienced instructors.
Assuming a good CFI in all the context that makes a good CFI, the more
experienced the GOOD instructor, the more concentration on the basics and
less concentration on ANY FACTOR in the learning curve that would confuse or
overload the student.
I would disagree with your analogy concerning more experienced instructors
as stated, and instead advise any new student to seek "quality" in a new
instructor by reference and/or personal interview; preferably both.
If this quality is found, it will most likely be even more pronounced, not
less pronounced in the "experienced" instructor.
Dudley Henriques

Are you sure about the CFI not having an instrument rating. This doesn't
sound right, since a CFI has to have a Commercial rating, and with some
exceptions all commercial ratings have an instrument rating first.
Maybe what was meant is that the CFI has no rating for instrument
instruction. That would be no big deal for working on a private. The new
CFI will probably be getting a II rating soon.

"BillJ" wrote in message
...

Are you sure about the CFI not having an instrument rating. This doesn't
sound right, since a CFI has to have a Commercial rating, and with some
exceptions all commercial ratings have an instrument rating first.

Where did you get that idea?

There's absolutely no relation between the Commercial certificate and the
Instrument-Airplane rating, other than some restrictions on what a
Commercial pilot may do without the Instrument rating.

Nothing about having a Commercial certificate in any way implies having an
Instrument rating.

Pete

Except that the pilot (61.133 (b) (1)) will have stamped on their
certificate a prohibition about carrying persons for hire more than 50 miles
*or* at night without an instrument rating. I'd like to see a General
Counsel interpretation as to whether this clause would also prohibit flight
instruction for hire to these limitations.

My suspicion is that it probably WOULD be interpreted with these
limitations, so cross country or night instruction would be out, and would
severely limit the instructor rating.

Jim





"Peter Duniho" wrote in message
...



Nothing about having a Commercial certificate in any way implies having an
Instrument rating.

Pete

"RST Engineering" wrote in message
...
Except that the pilot (61.133 (b) (1)) will have stamped on their
certificate a prohibition about carrying persons for hire more than 50
miles *or* at night without an instrument rating. I'd like to see a
General Counsel interpretation as to whether this clause would also
prohibit flight instruction for hire to these limitations.

My suspicion is that it probably WOULD be interpreted with these
limitations, so cross country or night instruction would be out, and would
severely limit the instructor rating.

Jim


I don't understand why you think they would interpret it that way. They have
already made it very clear that an instructor isn't in the airplane to fly
but rather to teach. A CFI isn't exercising the privileges of his commercial
ticket when he is teaching as exampled by NOT having to have a 2nd class
medical.

So long as (s)he isn't charging the student ...


Jim




"Gig 601XL Builder" wr.giacona@coxDOTnet wrote in message
news:VxqNe.2119$7f5.1954@okepread01...

I don't understand why you think they would interpret it that way. They
have already made it very clear that an instructor isn't in the airplane
to fly but rather to teach. A CFI isn't exercising the privileges of his
commercial ticket when he is teaching as exampled by NOT having to have a
2nd class medical.