F22 air dams/strakes: the definitive answer.

being a Cav Scout, i went and collected information......

i e-mailed "Lockmart" and received this reply today:


-----Original Message-----
From: redc1c4
Sent: Thursday, November 13, 2003 9:48 PM
To: Caires, Greg A }
Subject: a quick question


i am participating in the newsgroup rec.aviation.military where the
discussion centers around the existence or lack thereof of "strakes"
or "air dams" in and around the vertical stabilizers of the F22.

the general consensus is that there were some affixed temporarily
after a problem was discovered, but that an engineering fix has made
them unnecessary, and for obvious reasons relating to stealth
characteristics, they have not been retained.

the quote in question is:
"The wing parts were added to correct the wash across the tail
occurring for the "entire flight envelope". Unless Lockmart has
addressed the tail crack issue in a different manner, the 8 inch
wing "reflectors" have to be there."

so, does the F-22 have such an attachment?
(assuming, of course, that this information is not classified.)

thanks in advance for your organization's time in this small matter.

reply portion follows

The discussion you've included is a bit mixed. There were two issues
that I think have become confused.

The first was a "tail crack" issue with the HORIZONTAL stabilators.
The composite skins were delaminating (pulling off the internal
structure). We redesigned the stabilator to include more titanium and
its working.

The fin buffet or tail flutter issue involved the VERTICAL stabilizers,
which was fixed by stiffening the internal structure with additional
titanium.

There are no air dams or strakes or anything else. Here is a recent
photo -- you should be able to see how smooth the jets external mold
lines are.

Thanks for asking,

Greg

i can forward the e-mail, should anyone feel the need.

the picture in question will be posted to ABPM.

i expect my apology from Tarver to be posted here in RAM.

redc1c4,
(but i won't be holding my breath %-)
--
"Enlisted men are stupid, but extremely cunning and sly, and bear
considerable watching."

Army Officer's Guide

Admin wrote:

(sorry 'bout the "Admin" thing.... that's a usDOTsplat joke %-)

redc1c4
--
"Enlisted men are stupid, but extremely cunning and sly, and bear
considerable watching."

Army Officer's Guide

So what I wrote in the first place is correct.

Of course I would not necessarily believe lockmart that the titanium "is
working" as the program has a history of hiding deficiencies. Those
deficiencies covered up include these same tail cracks, which wa a story
broken by Reuters 6 months after the delamination was discovered.

The only way to know if the third attempt to fix the F-22's tail is to fly
the airplane 500 hours.

"redc1c4" wrote in message
...
Admin wrote:

(sorry 'bout the "Admin" thing.... that's a usDOTsplat joke %-)

That's ok, it is just another sock where you are more of a prick; as I have
seen your admin posts.

On Fri, 14 Nov 2003 08:55:16 -0800, "Tarver Engineering"
wrote:

So what I wrote in the first place is correct.

"You men like the 8 inchers added to the F-22 wings? "

Uh that would be N-O. Thanks for playing P-O-S-E-R.




Of course I would not necessarily believe lockmart that the titanium "is
working" as the program has a history of hiding deficiencies. Those
deficiencies covered up include these same tail cracks, which wa a story
broken by Reuters 6 months after the delamination was discovered.

\

Yeah and we didn't land on the moon and we have aliens locked up in
hangar 18 right next to the
do-take-photos-of-them-or-you'll-go-to-jail F-22s with the strakes.




The only way to know if the third attempt to fix the F-22's tail is to fly
the airplane 500 hours.


Sans strakes. Just like every other solution they've implemented.

Tarver Engineering wrote:

So what I wrote in the first place is correct.

Of course I would not necessarily believe lockmart that the titanium "is
working" as the program has a history of hiding deficiencies. Those
deficiencies covered up include these same tail cracks, which wa a story
broken by Reuters 6 months after the delamination was discovered.

The only way to know if the third attempt to fix the F-22's tail is to fly
the airplane 500 hours.

what you wrote in the first place in the thread is:


"You men like the 8 inchers added to the F-22 wings? "

how that squares with Lockheed's reply, and the picture provided,
is something i'll leave to you to explain.

redc1c4,
it's sure to be entertaining, but unlikely to be educational.
--
"Enlisted men are stupid, but extremely cunning and sly, and bear
considerable watching."

Army Officer's Guide

"Scott Ferrin" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 14 Nov 2003 08:55:16 -0800, "Tarver Engineering"
wrote:

So what I wrote in the first place is correct.

"You men like the 8 inchers added to the F-22 wings? "

That is what Lockmart said publicly about their airplane.

Now we have Lockmart are claiming the titanium will not be strike three on
the F-22's tail issues, but the history of the program indicates there is no
reason to believe them.

Tarver Engineering wrote:

"redc1c4" wrote in message
...
Admin wrote:

(sorry 'bout the "Admin" thing.... that's a usDOTsplat joke %-)

That's ok, it is just another sock where you are more of a prick; as I have
seen your admin posts.

hardly a "sock", since i make no effort to disguise my identity....
you should stick to aeronautical engineering as a field of expertise,
since Usenet terminology is evidently NOT your strong suit.
that way you'll cut down on the number of occasions you're made to look
like a complete ass.

redc1c4,
as for being a prick, that gives us something in common:
in my case, an accident of birth. but you sir, are a self made man.
--
"Enlisted men are stupid, but extremely cunning and sly, and bear
considerable watching."

Army Officer's Guide

"redc1c4" wrote in message
...
Tarver Engineering wrote:

So what I wrote in the first place is correct.

Of course I would not necessarily believe lockmart that the titanium "is
working" as the program has a history of hiding deficiencies. Those
deficiencies covered up include these same tail cracks, which wa a story
broken by Reuters 6 months after the delamination was discovered.

The only way to know if the third attempt to fix the F-22's tail is to
fly
the airplane 500 hours.

what you wrote in the first place in the thread is:


"You men like the 8 inchers added to the F-22 wings? "

how that squares with Lockheed's reply, and the picture provided,
is something i'll leave to you to explain.

Lockmart is trying to peddle strike three in their series of tail fixes as
one that has already worked, but it is going to take 500 hours of flight to
know that.

"redc1c4" wrote in message
...
Tarver Engineering wrote:

"redc1c4" wrote in message
...
Admin wrote:

(sorry 'bout the "Admin" thing.... that's a usDOTsplat joke %-)

That's ok, it is just another sock where you are more of a prick; as I
have
seen your admin posts.

hardly a "sock", since i make no effort to disguise my identity....
you should stick to aeronautical engineering as a field of expertise,
since Usenet terminology is evidently NOT your strong suit.

Sock, hose, same thing to me.

that way you'll cut down on the number of occasions you're made to look
like a complete ass.

Dude, you're a sock, being a complete ass is part of your jacket.