21st Century Grumman Tiger in South Florida

[Marty from Sunny Florida]

Hi all,



Just thought I'd share a marvelous experience. Over the years I've been in
and out of several old single engine cessnas, (c150 and 172's).



This morning, (June 29, 2004), I was invited to try out a 2003 Tiger; an
invitation I couldn't refuse.



I met up with the owner, Gerard at Lantana (KLNA) at 8:30am. It was a calm,
slightly overcast, hot day, and pretty typical of summer mornings in
Florida. We spent about 20 minutes chatting about the controls and discussed
a brief flight plan. For a variety of reasons, I was flying right seat.



In a nutshell, "WOW". This aircraft is gorgeous, sleek, purrs like a kitten,
flies like a bandit fleeing a bank robbery and is comfy like a Jaguar XJ
sedan.



The plane I flew has a loaded panel, complete with an autopilot that's
slaved to the Garmin GNS 430. You select a target destination on the Garmin,
and set the autopilot to take you there. That's it. Push the right buttons,
and you're as good as home!



The cockpit is drenched in leather, and the slide away cowl gives all the
open air you'd expect from a convertible BMW ! In flight we popped open the
canopy just a crack, and at just 2,000ft MSL, it felt like a comfy spring
day. In the 172, even with the windows open, you slowly cook in July.



The Tiger is owned by an ex-Navy pilot, who recently left his position at
American Airlines. A truly wonderful person with a passion for his family as
well as flying. If there's anyone I'd like to learn from, it's somebody like
Gerard. Competent, relaxed, and enthusiastic.



If you're in the South Florida area and interested in owning a Tiger, Gerard
has set up a fractional ownership plan, which is how I found myself in the
seat of this flying wonder. I'd spoken to Gerard a couple of times over the
phone, but had never met this pilot before today.



I'm back to the drawing board to see how my finances can get me into the
left seat, but it's certainly reachable. I could never come up with 1/5th
million dollars for a new Tiger, but I can buy 1/4 of it if I sneak out and
sell the wife's car (hush).



If you're interested in this plane, please tap me an email or call Marty at
561.478.1098. My email is - just dump the z's and
change the yyy to .net



Hope everyone's having a great summer.



Marty from Boiling Hot Sunny South Florida

[Dude]

I think its great when people get out and try new planes. The Tiger is the
most advanced of the sixties planes, so you should really get a kick out of
a nineties desgin.

Maybe you should try a really new plane before you leap -

Lancair, Diamond, and Cirrus make planes utilizing technology and methods
that are modern! No, they don't build them like they used to, THANK GOD!

On the other hand, if you like retreads billed as "new planes" then Piper
reintroduced the Cherokee Six, and Cessna is about to introduce a "new"
plane (be on the lookout for yet another configuration of an old spam can).

Piper has at least the desire to put out a truly new plane, but Cessna
doesn't give a hoot about folks in the sub million dollar plane market.

In the meantime, I will be praying that we get a new engine to replace the
40 year old engines used in the truly new planes.




"Marty from Sunny Florida" > wrote in message
...
> Hi all,
>
>
>
> Just thought I'd share a marvelous experience. Over the years I've been in
> and out of several old single engine cessnas, (c150 and 172's).
>
>
>
> This morning, (June 29, 2004), I was invited to try out a 2003 Tiger; an
> invitation I couldn't refuse.
>
>
>
> I met up with the owner, Gerard at Lantana (KLNA) at 8:30am. It was a
calm,
> slightly overcast, hot day, and pretty typical of summer mornings in
> Florida. We spent about 20 minutes chatting about the controls and
discussed
> a brief flight plan. For a variety of reasons, I was flying right seat.
>
>
>
> In a nutshell, "WOW". This aircraft is gorgeous, sleek, purrs like a
kitten,
> flies like a bandit fleeing a bank robbery and is comfy like a Jaguar XJ
> sedan.
>
>
>
> The plane I flew has a loaded panel, complete with an autopilot that's
> slaved to the Garmin GNS 430. You select a target destination on the
Garmin,
> and set the autopilot to take you there. That's it. Push the right
buttons,
> and you're as good as home!
>
>
>
> The cockpit is drenched in leather, and the slide away cowl gives all the
> open air you'd expect from a convertible BMW ! In flight we popped open
the
> canopy just a crack, and at just 2,000ft MSL, it felt like a comfy spring
> day. In the 172, even with the windows open, you slowly cook in July.
>
>
>
> The Tiger is owned by an ex-Navy pilot, who recently left his position at
> American Airlines. A truly wonderful person with a passion for his family
as
> well as flying. If there's anyone I'd like to learn from, it's somebody
like
> Gerard. Competent, relaxed, and enthusiastic.
>
>
>
> If you're in the South Florida area and interested in owning a Tiger,
Gerard
> has set up a fractional ownership plan, which is how I found myself in the
> seat of this flying wonder. I'd spoken to Gerard a couple of times over
the
> phone, but had never met this pilot before today.
>
>
>
> I'm back to the drawing board to see how my finances can get me into the
> left seat, but it's certainly reachable. I could never come up with 1/5th
> million dollars for a new Tiger, but I can buy 1/4 of it if I sneak out
and
> sell the wife's car (hush).
>
>
>
> If you're interested in this plane, please tap me an email or call Marty
at
> 561.478.1098. My email is - just dump the z's
and
> change the yyy to .net
>
>
>
> Hope everyone's having a great summer.
>
>
>
> Marty from Boiling Hot Sunny South Florida
>
>
>
>

[Aaron Coolidge]

Dude > wrote:
: In the meantime, I will be praying that we get a new engine to replace the
: 40 year old engines used in the truly new planes.

The diamond twinstar with the Thielert (sp?) engines is a compelling
argument that we have a new engine... if the engine lives up to its
marketing.

--
Aaron Coolidge

[OtisWinslow]

Tigers are fast, fun, simple airplanes. But I doubt I'd spend $225k+ for a
new
one when you can find nice used ones with exactly the same performance for
a third of that.

"Marty from Sunny Florida" > wrote in message
...
> Hi all,
>
>
>
> Just thought I'd share a marvelous experience. Over the years I've been in
> and out of several old single engine cessnas, (c150 and 172's).
>
>
>
> This morning, (June 29, 2004), I was invited to try out a 2003 Tiger; an
> invitation I couldn't refuse.
>
>
>
> I met up with the owner, Gerard at Lantana (KLNA) at 8:30am. It was a
calm,
> slightly overcast, hot day, and pretty typical of summer mornings in
> Florida. We spent about 20 minutes chatting about the controls and
discussed
> a brief flight plan. For a variety of reasons, I was flying right seat.
>
>
>
> In a nutshell, "WOW". This aircraft is gorgeous, sleek, purrs like a
kitten,
> flies like a bandit fleeing a bank robbery and is comfy like a Jaguar XJ
> sedan.
>
>
>
> The plane I flew has a loaded panel, complete with an autopilot that's
> slaved to the Garmin GNS 430. You select a target destination on the
Garmin,
> and set the autopilot to take you there. That's it. Push the right
buttons,
> and you're as good as home!
>
>
>
> The cockpit is drenched in leather, and the slide away cowl gives all the
> open air you'd expect from a convertible BMW ! In flight we popped open
the
> canopy just a crack, and at just 2,000ft MSL, it felt like a comfy spring
> day. In the 172, even with the windows open, you slowly cook in July.
>
>
>
> The Tiger is owned by an ex-Navy pilot, who recently left his position at
> American Airlines. A truly wonderful person with a passion for his family
as
> well as flying. If there's anyone I'd like to learn from, it's somebody
like
> Gerard. Competent, relaxed, and enthusiastic.
>
>
>
> If you're in the South Florida area and interested in owning a Tiger,
Gerard
> has set up a fractional ownership plan, which is how I found myself in the
> seat of this flying wonder. I'd spoken to Gerard a couple of times over
the
> phone, but had never met this pilot before today.
>
>
>
> I'm back to the drawing board to see how my finances can get me into the
> left seat, but it's certainly reachable. I could never come up with 1/5th
> million dollars for a new Tiger, but I can buy 1/4 of it if I sneak out
and
> sell the wife's car (hush).
>
>
>
> If you're interested in this plane, please tap me an email or call Marty
at
> 561.478.1098. My email is - just dump the z's
and
> change the yyy to .net
>
>
>
> Hope everyone's having a great summer.
>
>
>
> Marty from Boiling Hot Sunny South Florida
>
>
>
>

[Stu Gotts]

On Thu, 01 Jul 2004 12:21:21 GMT, "OtisWinslow"
> wrote:

>Tigers are fast, fun, simple airplanes. But I doubt I'd spend $225k+ for a
>new
>one when you can find nice used ones with exactly the same performance for
>a third of that.

Yes, but isn't that true of all the new planes?
>

[Dude]

Just the retreads.

The people that are investing in new airframes need our support. Next time
you here some so and so throw out a cute remark about how nothing was or
will ever be better than a "blank", just smack them. They are trying to
sound old and wise and cool, but they are killing GA.

If the plane you always wanted is now being made new, and you want one, then
buy it. But don't go around saying people are stupid for buying one of the
new planes. I am tired of hearing it from people who don't know I have one.

Mostly, its old FBO guys who start eating their words when they realize they
just PO'd a likely customer. They also get dumb looks on their faces when I
point out that their business has never grown because they NEVER changed it.
Can anyone point out an industry with less change that has grown?

Believe it or not, there have been advances in everything except aviation
for the last forty years. The first really new piston designs since the
sixties are now out, and many of them ARE superior.

I will get off the stump now, thanks.


"Stu Gotts" > wrote in message
...
> On Thu, 01 Jul 2004 12:21:21 GMT, "OtisWinslow"
> > wrote:
>
> >Tigers are fast, fun, simple airplanes. But I doubt I'd spend $225k+ for
a
> >new
> >one when you can find nice used ones with exactly the same performance
for
> >a third of that.
>
> Yes, but isn't that true of all the new planes?
> >
>

[Marty from Sunny Florida]

I have to agree with Dude on his assement of Old vs. New. The panel on this
Gruman is definately 21st century. It has 2, (TWO), yes more than one,
identical Garmin GNS 430's. The cost of these two items is about the same as
an entire average 1975 Cessna 150. Add the rest of the plane, and you can
quickly see some true value in it. The autopilot is slaved to the GPS, so
push a few buttons, find your airport, and you're there. I've played with an
autopilot in a 30 year old C172; it makes the wings level out. Truly nothing
like the rig in this Tiger.

The 180Hp engine kicks up a storm, and the plane just handles like a rocket.
One of my favorite pieces of the Tiger are the yolks. Both grips are wrapped
in leather, and the pilot's side has several controls, including the
autopilot select/activate.

I can't say enough about how much fun this plane is, and will post some
photos in the next week or so.

Thanks for the support, DUDE!

Marty from Wonderful West Palm Beach

ps. If you're interested in a fractional ownership for this plane, please
tap me an email or call Marty at
561.478.1098. My email is - just dump the z's and
change the yyy to .net
Have all the fun and prestige at a fraction of the cost !!!!




"Dude" > wrote in message
...
> Just the retreads.
>
> The people that are investing in new airframes need our support. Next
time
> you here some so and so throw out a cute remark about how nothing was or
> will ever be better than a "blank", just smack them. They are trying to
> sound old and wise and cool, but they are killing GA.
>
> If the plane you always wanted is now being made new, and you want one,
then
> buy it. But don't go around saying people are stupid for buying one of the
> new planes. I am tired of hearing it from people who don't know I have
one.
>
> Mostly, its old FBO guys who start eating their words when they realize
they
> just PO'd a likely customer. They also get dumb looks on their faces when
I
> point out that their business has never grown because they NEVER changed
it.
> Can anyone point out an industry with less change that has grown?
>
> Believe it or not, there have been advances in everything except aviation
> for the last forty years. The first really new piston designs since the
> sixties are now out, and many of them ARE superior.
>
> I will get off the stump now, thanks.
>
>
> "Stu Gotts" > wrote in message
> ...
> > On Thu, 01 Jul 2004 12:21:21 GMT, "OtisWinslow"
> > > wrote:
> >
> > >Tigers are fast, fun, simple airplanes. But I doubt I'd spend $225k+
for
> a
> > >new
> > >one when you can find nice used ones with exactly the same performance
> for
> > >a third of that.
> >
> > Yes, but isn't that true of all the new planes?
> > >
> >
>
>

[Dylan Smith]

In article >, Dude wrote:
> Just the retreads.

If it was right in the wind tunnel in 1975, it's right in the wind
tunnel today. A brand new Grumman is still a good plane, so don't just
write it off. But...

> The people that are investing in new airframes need our support. Next time
> you here some so and so throw out a cute remark about how nothing was or
> will ever be better than a "blank", just smack them. They are trying to
> sound old and wise and cool, but they are killing GA.

....but if I had the sort of money to buy a brand new plane, it'd be the
new Cirrus with the all-glass cockpit. It looks absolutely fantastic.
Or possibly a Diamond Twin Star. (I've flown the single-engine DA-40
Star, and it is very lustworthy)

There seems to be a lot of OWTs about composite planes - you can just
look at the experience with glass gliders over the past 25 years to see
that most of them are just that - old wives tales.

--
Dylan Smith, Castletown, Isle of Man
Flying: http://www.dylansmith.net
Frontier Elite Universe: http://www.alioth.net
"Maintain thine airspeed, lest the ground come up and smite thee"

[Dude]

I don't have anything against the Tigers, or really, what I call the
"retreads". They are mostly all excellent machines and the people who build
them are doing good work.

New Tiger took a big financial risk to bring back a cult favorite. It was a
good design that makes some good trade offs. I never understood why they
did not sell more in the first place.

OTOH, I am dissappointed in a certain market leader that has the financial
ability to take the risk on a new plane, but will not. That is a perfectly
acceptable business decision for them. Unfortunately, they are doing
several things to poison the market and GA in order to continue milking the
business they have.

Nothing against the planes, but I personally wish something would change
with the situation.




"Dylan Smith" > wrote in message
...
> In article >, Dude wrote:
> > Just the retreads.
>
> If it was right in the wind tunnel in 1975, it's right in the wind
> tunnel today. A brand new Grumman is still a good plane, so don't just
> write it off. But...
>
> > The people that are investing in new airframes need our support. Next
time
> > you here some so and so throw out a cute remark about how nothing was or
> > will ever be better than a "blank", just smack them. They are trying to
> > sound old and wise and cool, but they are killing GA.
>
> ...but if I had the sort of money to buy a brand new plane, it'd be the
> new Cirrus with the all-glass cockpit. It looks absolutely fantastic.
> Or possibly a Diamond Twin Star. (I've flown the single-engine DA-40
> Star, and it is very lustworthy)
>
> There seems to be a lot of OWTs about composite planes - you can just
> look at the experience with glass gliders over the past 25 years to see
> that most of them are just that - old wives tales.
>
> --
> Dylan Smith, Castletown, Isle of Man
> Flying: http://www.dylansmith.net
> Frontier Elite Universe: http://www.alioth.net
> "Maintain thine airspeed, lest the ground come up and smite thee"

[OtisWinslow]

Not neccesarily. I'm talking about Tigers only. Some new planes are
indeed a step up from the old stuff. But it's the same old Tiger with a
nice interior and a couple 430s. And nothing against Tigers, I used to
own one. They're great planes.



"Stu Gotts" > wrote in message
...
> On Thu, 01 Jul 2004 12:21:21 GMT, "OtisWinslow"
> > wrote:
>
> >Tigers are fast, fun, simple airplanes. But I doubt I'd spend $225k+ for
a
> >new
> >one when you can find nice used ones with exactly the same performance
for
> >a third of that.
>
> Yes, but isn't that true of all the new planes?
> >
>

[Jeremy Lew]

The certain market leader is getting their lunch eaten by Cirrus, who last
year sold more piston engine singles. They will probably have to put up
something new or exit the market sooner or later.

"Dude" > wrote in message
...
> OTOH, I am dissappointed in a certain market leader that has the financial
> ability to take the risk on a new plane, but will not. That is a
perfectly
> acceptable business decision for them. Unfortunately, they are doing
> several things to poison the market and GA in order to continue milking
the
> business they have.

[Dude]

Unfortunately, they have too much power to go easily, even thought they
really do not want the business. Being publicly owned, they need a way to
get our gracefully and profitably. They have lost the passion, but that
just makes them even more dangerous.

"Jeremy Lew" > wrote in message
...
> The certain market leader is getting their lunch eaten by Cirrus, who last
> year sold more piston engine singles. They will probably have to put up
> something new or exit the market sooner or later.
>
> "Dude" > wrote in message
> ...
> > OTOH, I am dissappointed in a certain market leader that has the
financial
> > ability to take the risk on a new plane, but will not. That is a
> perfectly
> > acceptable business decision for them. Unfortunately, they are doing
> > several things to poison the market and GA in order to continue milking
> the
> > business they have.
>
>

[Matt Whiting]

Jeremy Lew wrote:

> The certain market leader is getting their lunch eaten by Cirrus, who last
> year sold more piston engine singles. They will probably have to put up
> something new or exit the market sooner or later.

It is sad as you have to believe that a company with Cessna's resources
could design a might fine composite airplane. However, I'll also bet it
is the lawyers and not the engineers that are in the way. The liability
of a new design with new materials would be enormous and Cessna has a
lot to loss unlike Cirrus and the other upstarts.

I also think Cessna won't remain long in the SE market. They make more
on the jets and have a lot less liability per dollar with them as well.


Matt