How to file for practice appch at a military base?

You are going to get a clearance to the airport, no matter what you file.
Filing to an IAF is not necessary, IMHO. Comm failure is an emergency
situation, opening the door to doing whatever you want to do under the PIC
privilege.

Bob Gardner

"zatatime" wrote in message
...
On 7 Jul 2004 09:53:20 -0700, (Robert M. Gary)
wrote:

Whenever you are going to a semi-busy airport, don't worry about
filing all the way to the IAF, just to the general area. You'll always
get vectors anyway.


What do you when you get to the "general area" while experiencing a
comm failure?

Planning to the IAF gives you procedures to follow if this were to
happen and all parties involved will know what to expect.

z

Why would comm failure be an emergency? If you follow the FARs both you
and ATC know what you should be doing all the way to your planned
destination. There should be no safety of flight issue so I think you
would have some explaining to do if you "diverted" to a military
airfield.

BTW I played phone tag today with some air operations officer, I'll try
him again tomorrow. I was surprised he even called me back, his
secretary wasn't too pleasant. "Well if there's nothing in it for us we
aren't gonna let you do a practice approach, but we'll see what the air
ops officer says."


"Bob Gardner" wrote in
:

You are going to get a clearance to the airport, no matter what you
file. Filing to an IAF is not necessary, IMHO. Comm failure is an
emergency situation, opening the door to doing whatever you want to do
under the PIC privilege.

Bob Gardner

"zatatime" wrote in message
...
On 7 Jul 2004 09:53:20 -0700, (Robert M. Gary)
wrote:

Whenever you are going to a semi-busy airport, don't worry about
filing all the way to the IAF, just to the general area. You'll
always get vectors anyway.


What do you when you get to the "general area" while experiencing a
comm failure?

Planning to the IAF gives you procedures to follow if this were to
happen and all parties involved will know what to expect.

z

Responding to a couple of different postings with a single reply, sorry...

Yossarian wrote:
Why would comm failure be an emergency? If you follow the FARs both you
and ATC know what you should be doing all the way to your planned
destination. There should be no safety of flight issue so I think you

You need to know what the FARs say so you can parrot it back for your oral exam.
However, there's a huge consensus that the best thing to do when you lose comm
and still have navigation capability is: get on the ground as quickly as
possible using any available nearby approach (assuming IMC, of course). I agree
with this consensus. You're free to decide for yourself.

would have some explaining to do if you "diverted" to a military
airfield.

I didn't hear anyone advocating diverting to a military airfield due to lost comm.


BTW I played phone tag today with some air operations officer, I'll try
him again tomorrow. I was surprised he even called me back, his
secretary wasn't too pleasant. "Well if there's nothing in it for us we
aren't gonna let you do a practice approach, but we'll see what the air
ops officer says."


"Bob Gardner" wrote in
:


You are going to get a clearance to the airport, no matter what you
file. Filing to an IAF is not necessary, IMHO. Comm failure is an
emergency situation, opening the door to doing whatever you want to do
under the PIC privilege.

Bob Gardner

"zatatime" wrote in message
. ..

On 7 Jul 2004 09:53:20 -0700, (Robert M. Gary)
wrote:


Whenever you are going to a semi-busy airport, don't worry about
filing all the way to the IAF, just to the general area. You'll
always get vectors anyway.


What do you when you get to the "general area" while experiencing a
comm failure?

Planning to the IAF gives you procedures to follow if this were to
happen and all parties involved will know what to expect.

Planning is fine, but in general -filing- doesn't do much for you. You fly the
route you are cleared for, not the one you filed. In general, clearances are to
the airport, at least in my part of the USA. You might as well just file to the
airport to begin with.

BTW I played phone tag today with some air operations officer, I'll try
him again tomorrow. I was surprised he even called me back, his
secretary wasn't too pleasant. "Well if there's nothing in it for us we
aren't gonna let you do a practice approach, but we'll see what the air
ops officer says."

Sounds like you are trying this the civilian way by trying to get all
the top brass to agree to this. The military way would be to just fly
down there and ask the controller. If the controller is bored he'll
probably do it. We do practice approaches into Beale AFB and Travis
AFB around here and I've never known anyone to call ahead of time.
Worst case, they say no. Are you trying for a PAR approach??

-Robert

Robert M. Gary wrote:

If the controller is bored he'll
probably do it. We do practice approaches into Beale AFB and Travis
AFB around here and I've never known anyone to call ahead of time.

Don't controllers need to maintain currency on ASR/PAR approaches? I seem
to recall hearing this somewhere...

- Andrew

I fly out of a military airfield. The controllers at this low-traffic field
are always eager to have pilots fly practice PAR approaches because they
much prefer to maintain their currency with live approaches rather than the
simulator. They frequently ask if we can give them a practice approach.
Usually I am flying with a student and I don't want to use the student's
time to give the controllers a practice approach, but sometimes the student
thinks it will be a hoot so we do it. Any pilot can request a practice
approach, low approach only, and if the PAR is operational, they will
definitely get it. No prior coordination is necessary. I guess one could
call ahead to see if the PAR is operational, but that is available via
NOTAM.

Flying over Fort Knox once, the controller there offered a low approach on
his own initiative.


"Andrew Gideon" wrote in message
online.com...
Robert M. Gary wrote:

If the controller is bored he'll
probably do it. We do practice approaches into Beale AFB and Travis
AFB around here and I've never known anyone to call ahead of time.

Don't controllers need to maintain currency on ASR/PAR approaches? I seem
to recall hearing this somewhere...

- Andrew

Robert M. Gary wrote:


Sounds like you are trying this the civilian way by trying to get all
the top brass to agree to this. The military way would be to just fly
down there and ask the controller. If the controller is bored he'll
probably do it. We do practice approaches into Beale AFB and Travis
AFB around here and I've never known anyone to call ahead of time.
Worst case, they say no. Are you trying for a PAR approach??

-Robert

You're right; most watch supervisors are not willing to commit for
practice approach approvals ahead of time, because they don't want to
create any potential delays for base assigned aircraft. On the other
hand, if you're in the area and ask, they'll get you in as long as the
traffic at the base isn't heavy.
Don't bother asking the "air ops officer" or "Chief, Air Traffic Control
Operations" or anybody else other than the controllers that are working
the facility. You can relay this request through the TRACON or Center.
Incidentally, military controllers frequently notify the TRACON that
they need practice approach aircraft for controller training purposes,
so they may be sitting there just waiting for you to call!


JPH