Answer on CEF ILS RWY 23 questions

In a previous article, zatatime said:
On Thu, 14 Oct 2004 00:06:18 +0000 (UTC),
(Paul Tomblin) wrote:
the executive summary is that they put the step down to "provide
a constant descent rate on the procedure". Weird, eh?


Not only weird, but it does not answer our question. He has described
very well Why the approach was created this way, but in no way
communicates How a non-DME equipped aircraft can descend below 1160'
on a straight in LOC 23 approach. Even if it were possible to descend

John Haggerty raised that very question with him, and his response it that
because this is one of only three AFRC joint use airfields, they're going
to have to think about how to publish their procedures so that USAF and
civil pilots can both understand it. He says that in this case, they'll
be changing it to two plates - one called "ILS RWY 23" for the S-ILS,
S-LOC and CIRCLING, and one called "ILS or LOC/DME RWY 23" for the S-ILS
and S-LOC/DME and CIRCLING/DME. The first plate won't have the 1160
restriction, but will instead allow you to descend to the MDA after BELCH,
and the second will have a step down fix.

I'm not sure if having two plates for the same ILS will help or hurt
matters.

Personally, I wonder why they just don't move the step down fix closer to
the MAP, and make the intermediate altitude 900 feet. That was my first
reaction to Tim's first answer, and one that was suggested by John in his
followup question. But since Tim's first answer about the step-down fix
had some mention of preventing people from busting the circling MDA, I
doubt that this would satisfy that goal.


--
Paul Tomblin http://xcski.com/blogs/pt/
When the revolution comes, we'll need a longer wall.
-- Tom De Mulder

After all this haggling and confusion, I'll bet Paul is flying to BAF!!

In a previous article, (G Farris) said:
After all this haggling and confusion, I'll bet Paul is flying to BAF!!

You got that right.

--
Paul Tomblin http://xcski.com/blogs/pt/
char *p="char *p=%c%s%c;main(){printf(p,34,p,34);}";main(){print f(p,34,p,34);}

On Thu, 14 Oct 2004 15:27:03 +0000 (UTC),
(Paul Tomblin) wrote:

The first plate won't have the 1160
restriction, but will instead allow you to descend to the MDA after BELCH,
and the second will have a step down fix.


Hey...Thanks again for the info. This should help alleviate confusion
for all except Category E aircraft (aside from the pucker factor
regarding the 923' obstacle after BELCH). I'm wondering why they
don't just put in another cross radial from Chester to indicate
passage of the obstacle and clearance down to 900'. Both DME and
non-DME aircraft could then utilize the same approach. What might
restrict this is VOR inaccuracies, I'm not sure what criteria needs to
be met for that, but Chester is only about 20 miles away and it seems
like it could work.

Thanks again for the follow up, thanks to John for getting involved,
and good luck to Tim in solving this problem.

z

Thanks to Paul especially, for bringing it up in the first place, then
sticking it out, raising everyone's level of awareness.

May he have a safe and UNCOMPLICATED flight in and out of that world capital
of colleges and prep schools, and continue to share his IFR questions with all
of us.

There will be some beautiful scenery to see along that flight!

G Faris

On Thu, 14 Oct 2004 22:20:00 +0000 (UTC), (G
Farris) wrote:

Thanks to Paul especially, for bringing it up in the first place, then
sticking it out, raising everyone's level of awareness.

May he have a safe and UNCOMPLICATED flight in and out of that world capital
of colleges and prep schools, and continue to share his IFR questions with all
of us.

There will be some beautiful scenery to see along that flight!

G Faris


Here, Here.

And may he still be able to afford flying after the bills arrive for
sophmore year.

z