Immediate Action Items Checklist

On Jun 17, 7:58*pm, gatt wrote:

Seems like you could make a pretty succinct kneeboard checklist so
you're not wasting time flipping anything.

I have one, full page laminated and easily reachable in the passenger
door pouch..... in the real deal, it's really of no use...My answers
to Ol Shy and Bashful below.

On Jun 17, 5:46 pm, "Ol Shy & Bashful" wrote:
Do YOU have one?

Yes, but in the real deal emergency, valuable time wasted reaching for
it and getting oriented to where to start reading.

Do you rehearse it or practice it while the pressure is off? If not, why not?

No, too many variables and too many situations and most importantly,
not like the real deal.

What do you use for immediate action and why?

Trouble shooting first (AVIATE), Landing spot second (NAVIGATE),
declare emergency third (COMMUNICATE).

http://tinyurl.com/6ngvp7 for my in flight emergency and how I handled
it.

I consider it utmost important the emergency procedures be memorized,
as when the crap hits the fan, reading a list would be distracting and
may excasperate the problem.

NOW.... if I had a passenger, pulling the list and having them look it
over and read it to ensure I didn't miss anything would be good CRM.
In my case, it wouldn't have done squat.

On Jun 17, 10:10*pm, A Lieberman wrote:
On Jun 17, 7:58*pm, gatt wrote:

Seems like you could make a pretty succinct kneeboard checklist so
you're not wasting time flipping anything.

I have one, full page laminated and easily reachable in the passenger
door pouch..... in the real deal, it's really of no use...My answers
to Ol Shy and Bashful below.

On Jun 17, 5:46 pm, "Ol Shy & Bashful" wrote:

Do YOU have one?

Yes, but in the real deal emergency, valuable time wasted reaching for
it and getting oriented to where to start reading.

Do you rehearse it or practice it while the pressure is off? If not, why not?

No, too many variables and too many situations and most importantly,
not like the real deal.

What do you use for immediate action and why?

Trouble shooting first (AVIATE), Landing spot second (NAVIGATE),
declare emergency third (COMMUNICATE).

http://tinyurl.com/6ngvp7for my in flight emergency and how I handled
it.

I consider it utmost important the emergency procedures be memorized,
as when the crap hits the fan, reading a list would be distracting and
may excasperate the problem.

NOW.... if I had a passenger, pulling the list and having them look it
over and read it to ensure I didn't miss anything would be good CRM.
In my case, it wouldn't have done squat.

Not sure who I am replying to so bear with me? The most dangerous
emergency is with an engine problem down below 1000' agl (I refer to
that as the "Red Zone" and below 500' agl as the DARK RED Zone.
Certainly a competent pilot should have the immediate action items
memorized as there is little time to go digging out/reading a
checklist at low altitude with an emergency. And, I certainly am not
going to rely on a non-pilot to read the correct checklist in an
emergency?
For those who don't know me, I've been flying since the mid 50's, over
25,000 hours and nearly half that in ag operations with both FW/RW
worldwide. I've had a number of emergencies, engine failures,
mechanical failures, bird strikes, tree strikes, blown tires, brake
failures, prop failures, fuel problems, etc, etc ad infinitum. In
other words, enough real life experience to base my opinions on with a
reasonable degree of validity. Once you get past the bluster and
bull**** I think you'll find I have some valid points to consider.
I've got a book full of photos I've shot of broken airplanes and only
one of them was mine from very early in my career. I happened to be on
the different scenes and took the photos and/or talked with the pilot/
s involved. Includes a 737 that had a total electrical failure on
rotation from 25L at LGB and he stopped with his wingtip hanging over
the edge of the runway looking down on I-5. Talk about a high pucker
factor?!
My whole purpose here is to make pilots think about possibles and
variables. I fly nearly every day and do 70-80 hours a month
instructing. Even so I see new things weekly and new things to
consider. The potentials for disaster and accidents or incidents are
high here with a high volume of traffic and a mix of civil and
military aircraft. You have to keep safety in mind but temper it with
operational exigencies and realities. My sense of survival always has
me thinking of emergencies and I can't stop playing "what if ...."
I'll be 72 this year and not sure how much longer I'll stay in the
cockpit but I can guarantee I'll be thinking ahead of the aircraft as
long as I am.
Best Regards
Ol S&B

On Jun 17, 10:39*pm, "Ol Shy & Bashful" wrote:

Not sure who I am replying to so bear with me? The most dangerous
emergency is with an engine problem down below 1000' agl (I refer to
that as the "Red Zone" and below 500' agl as the DARK RED Zone.
Certainly a competent pilot should have the immediate action items
memorized as there is little time to go digging out/reading a
checklist at low altitude with an emergency.

I have a one page laminated document front and back taken directly
from the POH. As you indicated anything below 1000 feet, this
document probably will be of no use, but in the document, in big read
letters are the various stages of flight. In blue in 20 point text
are the steps to be taken during an emergency including my emergency
decent, glide and landing speeds.

The document is broken out in a very simple format. Head lines in red.

During take off Ground roll (obviously not designed for pulling out
either by me or passenger - fly the plane)
After lift off (again not designed for pulling out either by me or
passenger - open doors and fly the plane)

And, I certainly am not
going to rely on a non-pilot to read the correct checklist in an
emergency?

In Flight - This is where I would ask a passenger to pull out the list
and read what is on the page so I can continue focusing on aviating.
There are only 14 items and the since I have it committed to memory,
the read back from the passenger would be only a verification that
indeed I remembered everything. After all, as indicated in my link, I
had time, just not by myself to "challenge" my memory.

My whole purpose here is to make pilots think about possibles and
variables.

Good discussion and always good reminders from threads of this nature.

I fly nearly every day and do 70-80 hours a month
instructing. Even so I see new things weekly and new things to
consider. The potentials for disaster and accidents or incidents are
high here with a high volume of traffic and a mix of civil and
military aircraft. You have to keep safety in mind but temper it with
operational exigencies and realities.

Just a measly 820+ under my belt, but I try to think like you, what
if... For IFR, I even include my engine instrumention intermittently
in my scan so that I can catch trends and report it before it becomes
an emergency, keeping that what if scenario in my mind. It only takes
an extra second for some peace of mine that things are running full
tilt.

Just like simulated vs actual IMC conditions, emergencies are the same
in my opinion, while it's nice to practice them, to experience one is
a whole different beast, since now you have the adrenaline factor that
was missing in training.

Um, that would be the 405. I-5 is about ten miles northeast.

Jim

--
"It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought
without accepting it."
--Aristotle


Includes a 737 that had a total electrical failure on
rotation from 25L at LGB and he stopped with his wingtip hanging over
the edge of the runway looking down on I-5. Talk about a high pucker
factor?!

On Jun 17, 11:26*pm, "RST Engineering"
wrote:
Um, that would be the 405. *I-5 is about ten miles northeast.

Jim

--
"It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought
without accepting it."
* * * * --Aristotle

*Includes a 737 that had a total electrical failure on
rotation from 25L at LGB and he stopped with his wingtip hanging over
the edge of the runway looking down on I-5. Talk about a high pucker
factor?!

No wonder I kept getting lost on that damned freeway system!!! ggg
You are absolutely right of course and I operated out of LGB for years
and out of SNA for as many more. In fact, I started flying out of SNA
back in the mid 50's and worked the SoCal area for at least 20+ years.
The airplane was the old Western Airlines group and I think the
incident was about ....geeeezz '63-64? sometime in the 60's anyway....

Better not have been. I vacated the airlines when I graduated and went into
the space program and the first 737 had yet to be delivered to my airline in
the late 1967s, as I vaguely recall. I could be wrong.

Funny, back in the '60s I'd send students on cross-countries to SNA (now
John Wayne) without a thought of it. Nowadays I'd be nuts to do that.

Jim

--
"It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought
without accepting it."
--Aristotle



No wonder I kept getting lost on that damned freeway system!!! ggg
You are absolutely right of course and I operated out of LGB for years
and out of SNA for as many more. In fact, I started flying out of SNA
back in the mid 50's and worked the SoCal area for at least 20+ years.
The airplane was the old Western Airlines group and I think the
incident was about ....geeeezz '63-64? sometime in the 60's anyway....

On Wed, 18 Jun 2008 21:08:09 -0700, "RST Engineering"
wrote in
:

Funny, back in the '60s I'd send students on cross-countries to SNA (now
John Wayne) without a thought of it. Nowadays I'd be nuts to do that.

Right. Today, the wake turbulence from the B-757s landing on 19R and
jet blast from airliners holding between the runways on taxiway Lima,
not to mention the windshere and birds, can be lethal for a solo
student landing on 19L. But I've got a signature in my logbook from
someone at Martin Aviation in 1970 to verify my solo xcountry.

On Jun 19, 1:09*am, Larry Dighera wrote:
On Wed, 18 Jun 2008 21:08:09 -0700, "RST Engineering"
wrote in
:

Funny, back in the '60s I'd send students on cross-countries to SNA (now
John Wayne) without a thought of it. *Nowadays I'd be nuts to do that.

Right. *Today, the wake turbulence from the B-757s landing on 19R and
jet blast from airliners holding between the runways on taxiway Lima,
not to mention the windshere and birds, can be lethal for a solo
student landing on 19L. *But I've got a signature in my logbook from
someone at Martin Aviation in 1970 to verify my solo xcountry. *

You'd be hard pressed to even find where Martin was back then! I think
in the 70's it was still just south of the ramp area where air
carriers were parking. Mission Beech was on the north end and so was
transient parking. Long gone ...........Back when I first flew out of
SNA, there were parallel strips and one of them was used for drag
races on weekends! Torbet, Martin and Tallman aviation were all
operating. Mile Square was still popular for touch and goes and not
uncommon to see a mix of military and civilian aircraft in the
pattern ... also long gone for flying. Many of the old strips are
ancient history all across the country..

On Tue, 17 Jun 2008 20:39:21 -0700 (PDT), "Ol Shy & Bashful"
wrote:


me thinking of emergencies and I can't stop playing "what if ...."
I'll be 72 this year and not sure how much longer I'll stay in the
cockpit but I can guarantee I'll be thinking ahead of the aircraft as


seventy two!!!!!!

is that all. you have at least 27 years left in you before you reach
the age of my hero - the guy who renewed his class 1 instrument rating
at age 99.

remember the words of that australian song ... you're only as old as
the woman you feel :-)

stop worrying - go flying.
Stealth Pilot

That was a Groucho Marx line LONG before the Aussies stole it.

Jim


remember the words of that australian song ... you're only as old as
the woman you feel :-)