Clearance with an Odd Intersection

Has anyone received a route clearance that included an intersection that was
only on an approach chart and not in an Enroute Chart?
Flew IFR from FRG to GON with the following clearance: Farmingdale Three,
radar vectors BDR, direct MAD, MAD 126 radial to MONDI, direct.
For the life of me I couldn't find MONDI on the enroute. However, it was in
my (up-to-date) Garmin 430 database and it was pretty much on the way
(albeit a bit of a dogleg) so I didn't make it an issue. Turns out MONDI is
only on the KGON ILS RWY 5 and it's not even an IAF. The GPS RWY 33 was the
active approach which made it even more difficult to figure out.

Is this commom anywhere else? Should they have told me it was only on an
IAP chart? Are all the fixes on any of a given airport's approach charts
fair-game to include in an enroute clearance?

Regards,
Marco Leon

"Marco Leon" mleon(at)optonline.net wrote in
:

Has anyone received a route clearance that included an intersection
that was only on an approach chart and not in an Enroute Chart?

Sure. The ATC specialist who figures out the clearance may not even know
what charts it's on. You have to be flexible.

--
Regards,

Stan

"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary
safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." B. Franklin

"Stan Gosnell" wrote in message
...

Sure. The ATC specialist who figures out the clearance may not even know
what charts it's on. You have to be flexible.

So if I had queried the controller, then we'd have both been in the dark?
Sounds like we would have spent quite a bit of time looking. Well, if I have
to spread out my IAP charts, then I will. *sigh*

Thanks,

Marco



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On Thu, 24 Feb 2005 07:39:25 -0500, "Marco Leon"
mleon(at)optonline.net wrote:

So if I had queried the controller, then we'd have both been in the dark?
Sounds like we would have spent quite a bit of time looking. Well, if I have
to spread out my IAP charts, then I will. *sigh*


Something everyone should do before every instrument flight.

Here's some advice. Never launch on a clearance you have not
thoroughly reviewed for accuracy, fix by fix, right to the ground.

That way, you won't find yourself airborne reworking your clearance to
nowhere out with a controller (assuming your radio is working at the
time).

I did review them but I concentrated on the GPS 33 considering the winds
were 310. To be honest, I didn't think I needed to scour the approach charts
to verify my enroute clearance. Besides, the routing as mapped out on the
GPS verified that it was not a "route-to-nowhere" which is why I took off. I
also had another intersection in mind right next to it (BOROS) that was on
the enroute charts that I can follow if there was a mistake.

Regardless, I agree with your advice that one should know their entire route
clearance before departure.

Marco

wrote in message
...
On Thu, 24 Feb 2005 07:39:25 -0500, "Marco Leon"
mleon(at)optonline.net wrote:

So if I had queried the controller, then we'd have both been in the dark?
Sounds like we would have spent quite a bit of time looking. Well, if I
have
to spread out my IAP charts, then I will. *sigh*


Something everyone should do before every instrument flight.

Here's some advice. Never launch on a clearance you have not
thoroughly reviewed for accuracy, fix by fix, right to the ground.

That way, you won't find yourself airborne reworking your clearance to
nowhere out with a controller (assuming your radio is working at the
time).

Good advice. However, it's not always practical. As I learned early on in my
first few flights as a newly-minted IFR pilot, you ain't always going to get
what you file. Further more, you ain't always going to fly what you're
initially cleared for.

I've had plently of flights where my initial clearance didn't even remotely
resemble what I filed, and what I actually ended up flying didn't exactly
match the initial clearance. ATC has a interesting habit of dynamically
re-routing you based on traffic, weather, and how nice they're feeling that
day. Flexibility is certainly a key element of IFR flight (as is not
accepting a clearance that you're not comfortable with).

Being able to "re-route" in flight with the low-altitude chart in your lap
(or high-altitude, if you're lucky enough to fly such a beast) is a
necessary skill in IFR flying.

-- Dane

In article ,
wrote:
Here's some advice. Never launch on a clearance you have not
thoroughly reviewed for accuracy, fix by fix, right to the ground.

That way, you won't find yourself airborne reworking your clearance to
nowhere out with a controller (assuming your radio is working at the
time).

"Dane Spearing" wrote in message
...

I've had plently of flights where my initial clearance didn't even
remotely
resemble what I filed, and what I actually ended up flying didn't exactly
match the initial clearance. ATC has a interesting habit of dynamically
re-routing you based on traffic, weather, and how nice they're feeling
that
day.


Traffic and weather are pretty good reasons for rerouting, moods are not.



Flexibility is certainly a key element of IFR flight (as is not
accepting a clearance that you're not comfortable with).


Sometimes you have to choose between being a bit uncomfortable and not
making the flight.

"Dane Spearing" wrote in message
...

Good advice. However, it's not always practical. As I learned early on in
my

I've had plently of flights where my initial clearance didn't even
remotely
resemble what I filed, and what I actually ended up flying didn't exactly
match the initial clearance.

If I made it from Boston to White Plains without getting re-routed at least
once I'd expect to see locusts, four horsemen, and dogs and cats living
together when I landed. You file the preferred routes, they clear you
somewhere else, and up in the air they change their minds again often more
than once in the flight.

-cwk.

On Thu, 24 Feb 2005 07:39:25 -0500, "Marco Leon" mleon(at)optonline.net
wrote:

So if I had queried the controller, then we'd have both been in the dark?

Had you queried the controller about the location of the intersection, he
would be able to give you coordinates.


Ron (EPM) (N5843Q, Mooney M20E) (CP, ASEL, ASES, IA)

"Ron Rosenfeld" wrote in message
...
Had you queried the controller about the location of the intersection, he
would be able to give you coordinates.

As in LAT/LONG coordinates or radial fixes? Hadn't thought of that. I'll try
next time.

Marco