bad vectors, no hand off

Flyers,

I just want some of your thoughts on this. My plane partner and I went out
last night to do some practice instrument approaches. He wore the hood and
I was the right-seat safety pilot.

ATC was not too busy and it was a nice VFR night. First, after we asked for
a practice ILS 24 into KPNE they acknowledged our request and then forgot
about us and had us continue flying away from the field for sometime. This
continued until I finally asked if they were going to vector us.

"Oh...no...I just figured you'd turn toward Yardley."

Hmmm...ok we turn toward Yardley. He then had us climb to 3000. He
vectored us onto the approach within 1/8 mile of the final approach fix, had
us maintain 3000 (FAF alt on chart is 2000) and cleared us for the approach.
My partner was struggling to get the plane down and I'm looking out for
planes, our attitude, the glide slope, his airspeed,...IOW...everything.

I suddenly realize that we are on a 1/2 mile final (way above the glide
slope) and we were never handed off to the tower. I push the flip-flop
button and contact the tower and ask if we missed a handoff.

The tower responds, "I've been waiting for you to contact us"

"I'm sorry. Did approach hand us off?"

"No...but that doesn't matter...it's your responsibility. You need to
realize that there is a problem before you're on a 1/2 mile final."

To make a long story short...we were given back to approach and did the
approach into our field (VOR-A). We were handed off to another approach
controller. We asked for a practice VOR-A into N14 with vectors. This
controller never vectored us and merrily watched us (or didn't watch us) fly
right through the approach course, never vectoring us, never assigning an
altitude and never clearing us for the approach.

I get on the radio and asked if he wanted us to fly through the approach
course.

"Ahhh...no...just intercept the approach course and maintain 2100 until
PONDE (the FAF)..." he then cleared us for the approach.

What was this? A bad night for controllers? Were we second class citizens?
And why did I get bawled out for the approach controllers forgetful
hand-off?

Kobra

Lurker wrote:
The tower responds, "I've been waiting for you to contact us"

"I'm sorry. Did approach hand us off?"

"No...but that doesn't matter...it's your responsibility. You need to
realize that there is a problem before you're on a 1/2 mile final."


I've got to say I've never received such ****ty service in the South. Actually,
I can't say I've received such ****ty service anywhere. Since when is it your
responsibility to decide when to end communications with one controller and
begin with another? I think I'd be writing the FSDO or somebody and complain
loudly, with CC:'s to your local congresscritters. In fact, call and complain
immediately before the tapes get overwritten.


To make a long story short...we were given back to approach and did the
approach into our field (VOR-A). We were handed off to another approach
controller. We asked for a practice VOR-A into N14 with vectors. This
controller never vectored us and merrily watched us (or didn't watch us) fly
right through the approach course, never vectoring us, never assigning an
altitude and never clearing us for the approach.


You know, if they didn't want to bother with you, the least they could have done
is tell you so. Or is it their position that that is your responsibility to
determine as well?



--
Mortimer Schnerd, RN
mschnerdatcarolina.rr.com

I'd call the Tower Manager and ask him to look into it.
Unless the tape retention has changed they are required to retain the
tape(s) for 15 days.
They then are rotated back into service
Al


"Mortimer Schnerd, RN" mschnerdatcarolina.rr.com wrote in message
...
Lurker wrote:
The tower responds, "I've been waiting for you to contact us"

"I'm sorry. Did approach hand us off?"

"No...but that doesn't matter...it's your responsibility. You need to
realize that there is a problem before you're on a 1/2 mile final."

45 days.



Allan9 wrote:
I'd call the Tower Manager and ask him to look into it.
Unless the tape retention has changed they are required to retain the
tape(s) for 15 days.
They then are rotated back into service
Al

"Newps" wrote in message


45 days.

....and do they really use tapes? I thought it was all hard drives now.

--
John T
http://sage1solutions.com/blogs/TknoFlyer
Reduce spam. Use Sender Policy Framework: http://openspf.org
____________________

Lurker wrote:
Were we second class citizens?

Depends. Were you flying a Cherokee?

In article ,
Newps wrote:


Lurker wrote:
Were we second class citizens?

Depends. Were you flying a Cherokee?

HEY!!!! I resemble that remark.

-- Dane, happy owner of a PA32-300

Dane Spearing wrote:
Were we second class citizens?

Depends. Were you flying a Cherokee?

HEY!!!! I resemble that remark.

-- Dane, happy owner of a PA32-300


On a only slightly related note, I was highly offended yesterday to note that
some undeserving slob (read: other than me) won that PA-32-260 that AOPA has
been showing around.

I mean, REALLY... it's not like I forgot to reup my membership.

The guy who won it already has about 9000 hours. He's probably tired of flying
already. They ought to let guys like me (well, actually me specifically) win.
I'd promise to go fly it quite a bit.


--
Mortimer Schnerd, RN
mschnerdatcarolina.rr.com

On Fri, 9 Feb 2007 14:04:59 -0500, "Mortimer Schnerd, RN"
mschnerdatcarolina.rr.com wrote:

On a only slightly related note, I was highly offended yesterday to note that
some undeserving slob (read: other than me) won that PA-32-260 that AOPA has
been showing around.

Me too...

There's always next year. -=8^(

And I liked the Six so much more than the Commander.

Bonehenge wrote:
There's always next year. -=8^(

And I liked the Six so much more than the Commander.


Me too. I've never flown a Commander but I've got a bunch of time flying a Six
to some very nice places. Never a 260 though... always a 300. I understand the
260 actually has more useful load... which is already kind of scary. I used to
carry 6 adults, baggage, and diving gear (except for tanks and weight belts)
from North Carolina to various spots in the Bahamas (with staging in and out of
the Vero Beach/ St. Lucie County area). One hell of a load... one hell of a
bird.

What did the guy who won the AOPA bird fly? C-130's? He's never gonna be
satisfied with a Six. Schmuck.




--
Mortimer Schnerd, RN
mschnerdatcarolina.rr.com